Author Topic: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild  (Read 194963 times)

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Gnarly4X

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1740 on: Feb 02, 2019, 04:33:03 PM »
"So I feel the rocker as the cam rotates completely around from the bottom of the base circle around the to base circle - one complete revolution of the camshaft?"  Yes, if you take the valve cover off again it wouldnt hurt.  Yes crank engine over by hand.  Aftermarket cams are weird.  Ive seen alot of weird high and low spots in cam lobes.  I always try to adjust to the highest spot of the lobe where there isnt supposed to be lift.  Just see if its too tight when its not supoosed to be.  Also, u have adjustable timing gear?  Make sure it hasnt moved...

OK.. I gotcha!!  I don't have an adjustable cam gear.  I do have an engnbldr cam.  Bgen has stated that he has seen defective cams from engnbldr.  The valve lash has gone tight about every 1500 to 2000 miles.  This 261C cam has the tightest valve lash spec I've seen.  7/9.

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1741 on: Feb 02, 2019, 04:37:07 PM »
"So I feel the rocker as the cam rotates completely around from the bottom of the base circle around the to base circle - one complete revolution of the camshaft?"  Yes, if you take the valve cover off again it wouldnt hurt.  Yes crank engine over by hand.  Aftermarket cams are weird.  Ive seen alot of weird high and low spots in cam lobes.  I always try to adjust to the highest spot of the lobe where there isnt supposed to be lift.  Just see if its too tight when its not supoosed to be.  Also, u have adjustable timing gear?  Make sure it hasnt moved...
I told him to back all the rocker arms way way off and redo the comp test.
He was supposed to have already done this. He is a bit of an askhole (listens to expert advice then procedes to do things his own way)
I told him He is doing something wrong and the test data does not add up. To many things wrong all at once.
I am 1/5th of Perfect Fit
SqWADoosh [04:19 PM]: *sigh* I guess Chris is right and I just need to wait until I'm in a place where I have a tow rig and trailer before I get this caliber of truck
Mudder [08:28 PM]:   not try to be a jerk, but are you serious bestgen?
Prismo [06:11 PM]:   Done, time to relax or as Bestgen says....FREEDOM!
HogCanyonHopper [06:54 PM]:   I like my little rod. it gets the job done
H8PVMNT [03:30 PM]: I can go both ways.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1742 on: Feb 02, 2019, 04:58:42 PM »
I told him to back all the rocker arms way way off and redo the comp test.


If I do the compression check with rockers backed off so both valves remain closed, what should the reading be?  With both valves closed, there is no air being pumped?  The air that is in the cylinder will be compressed to show an instant reading.  If the reading goes down, the air is being pumped out, either through leaky valves/guides/seals, through the rings, or head gasket?

I will do it... but I don't believe that will it make any difference other than the readings will be slightly different - lower.

 Gnarls.

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

EASYRYDERDANGER

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1743 on: Feb 02, 2019, 04:59:43 PM »
Gnarly, bestgens finds are mutual, so mutual that we actually diagnosed one together...  This is the reason we keep saying alot of the same stuff

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1744 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:04:29 PM »
Gnarly, bestgens finds are mutual, so mutual that we actually diagnosed one together...  This is the reason we keep saying alot of the same stuff
I have told him for a while that the engine builder cams are garbage and that I had first hand experience with it.
Your statement makes no sense but I know what Your talking about
I wish people would trust us
I am 1/5th of Perfect Fit
SqWADoosh [04:19 PM]: *sigh* I guess Chris is right and I just need to wait until I'm in a place where I have a tow rig and trailer before I get this caliber of truck
Mudder [08:28 PM]:   not try to be a jerk, but are you serious bestgen?
Prismo [06:11 PM]:   Done, time to relax or as Bestgen says....FREEDOM!
HogCanyonHopper [06:54 PM]:   I like my little rod. it gets the job done
H8PVMNT [03:30 PM]: I can go both ways.

EASYRYDERDANGER

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1745 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:08:49 PM »
Makes complete sense.  The sidejob we did (les shwab) that had 2 dead holes after you did a new cylinder head, we found they had no/low compression(remember my chitty compression gauge). It also ate its speedy sleeve and oil was everywhere.

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1746 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:21:56 PM »
Makes complete sense.  The sidejob we did (les shwab) that had 2 dead holes after you did a new cylinder head, we found they had no/low compression(remember my chitty compression gauge). It also ate its speedy sleeve and oil was everywhere.
Yes I remember. I said I know what You are talking about.  :smack:
This is where I learned what low quality cams Engine builder sells. They are low quality cam regrinds.
Also where I learned that an after market extra tight front crank will not work with a speedy sleeve.  :smack:
I think His name was Josh?
I'm sure this is what Gnarly has too. Been saying that for a few weeks.
I am 1/5th of Perfect Fit
SqWADoosh [04:19 PM]: *sigh* I guess Chris is right and I just need to wait until I'm in a place where I have a tow rig and trailer before I get this caliber of truck
Mudder [08:28 PM]:   not try to be a jerk, but are you serious bestgen?
Prismo [06:11 PM]:   Done, time to relax or as Bestgen says....FREEDOM!
HogCanyonHopper [06:54 PM]:   I like my little rod. it gets the job done
H8PVMNT [03:30 PM]: I can go both ways.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1747 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:29:14 PM »
I will do another compression check tomorrow morning - per the Toyota King, Prince, Guru, Master Mechanic, Toyota God, and other Royal titles.   :biggthumpup:

There is a mechanical somewhere.  It was running fine after adjusting the valve lash. Took it for a ride. Tach'd it up a about 3 times to 5,000 RPM. Parked it. Started it up about 6 hours later.... #1 cylinder was not firing? I believe the failure occurred when I was running through gears, I suspect I did NOT notice any misfire when I drove slowly back into the subdivision where I live.  It could not have failed sitting for 6 hours.  I suspect valves, valve seats.  The rings were bad from the beginning of my rebuild.  I don't see how the throttle response was so good if the camshaft was seriously defective.... but... I'm not an engine builder. :gap:

I don't have a speedy sleeve.

By the way, I have spoken to the man who supplied engnbldr's cams.  I will call him tomorrow and have another chat.  He's been doing/gringing cams for over 20 years, he's a really nice guy and sounds like really knows his poop!  I plan to put my truck on jack stands for the time being.  I will pull the camshaft (engnbldr 261C) and see if the cam grinder/supplier will look at it and mic it and tell me what he thinks.

Gnarls. :dunno:
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2019, 05:38:30 PM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Slabzilla

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1748 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:35:23 PM »
Hey Gnarls,  I've been following your post for quite a while hoping someone else would come up with a solution.  With a problem like yours I have an old sparkplug that I've busted out the ceramic/electrode and had a brass valvestem brazed onto the top.  You screw that into the plug holes one at a time with all the valves closed add some compressed air and listen, look and watch for where the air makes it's escape.  Out the rad. it's head gasket, out the valve cover it's rings, out the exhaust burnt ex.valves, intake bent or bad in,valve.  Sometime simple solutions solve problems the quickest and no burnt fingers.  Hope this helps.   :therethere:
'85 Xtra-cab, 4.5" Downey Off-Road lift, 12-15 KM2's on American Racing Baja's, Marlin's-4.88's & 4.7's, Downey Off-Road CAI, Marlin rear bumper & sliders

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1749 on: Feb 02, 2019, 05:43:47 PM »
Slabzilla... I like the trick.

How often do these heads (aftermarket) have a valve seat, valve guide fail?  It went about 26,000 miles after the rebuild.  Although it was burning a quart of oil every 600 miles, it ran great, good throttle response.  Only got about 17.5 miles per gallon on 87 octane.

I was surprised to see the coolant pumping out the radiator filler!! ... head gasket?  :disturbed: ... head gasket was from engnbldr's kit.  Shoulda gone by my gut.... Fel-Pro!!

Gnarls. :blah:
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2019, 05:55:23 PM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1750 on: Feb 02, 2019, 06:53:23 PM »
Slabzilla... I like the trick.

How often do these heads (aftermarket) have a valve seat, valve guide fail?  It went about 26,000 miles after the rebuild.  Although it was burning a quart of oil every 600 miles, it ran great, good throttle response.  Only got about 17.5 miles per gallon on 87 octane.

I was surprised to see the coolant pumping out the radiator filler!! ... head gasket?  :disturbed: ... head gasket was from engnbldr's kit.  Shoulda gone by my gut.... Fel-Pro!!

Gnarls. :blah:
Come on Gnarly!
Head gasket needs to come out of a Toyota package. You still haven't learned this yet.  :smack:
Cheaper is not better.
I am 1/5th of Perfect Fit
SqWADoosh [04:19 PM]: *sigh* I guess Chris is right and I just need to wait until I'm in a place where I have a tow rig and trailer before I get this caliber of truck
Mudder [08:28 PM]:   not try to be a jerk, but are you serious bestgen?
Prismo [06:11 PM]:   Done, time to relax or as Bestgen says....FREEDOM!
HogCanyonHopper [06:54 PM]:   I like my little rod. it gets the job done
H8PVMNT [03:30 PM]: I can go both ways.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1751 on: Feb 03, 2019, 05:20:29 AM »
Come on Gnarly!
Head gasket needs to come out of a Toyota package. You still haven't learned this yet.  :smack:
Cheaper is not better.

 :haha:  :)bestgen4runner ....  :ha_ha: :laugh: :hahaha: :joke:

bgen.... I know how to push your "Toyota" buttons!!!  :gap: :yupyup:

When, and if I do it, the head gasket will be a Toyota factory part.  :thumbs:

To be absolutely clear.... I DON'T KNOW IF THE FAILURES I THINK HAVE BEEN DETERMINED BY MY LEAK DOWN TEST AND COMPRESSION TEST IS DUE TO POOR QUALITY PARTS, DEFECTIVE PARTS, MY LACK OF ENGINE REBUILDING SKILLS, OR SOME OTHER REASON.

I would like to ship this engine to Jim at 22RE Performance and have him tear it down and inspect it and tell me what happened.

Again.... hindsight is 20-20!!  I had mulltiple conversations with Tod at engnbldr.  I asked him about the historical head and head gasket issues with the 20s/22s.  He said the gasket in the "kit" is the same used for the 22RET engines.. sounded like it was a top quality part!   At that point in my research, I didn't have any valid reason to believe he was bs'ing me.  I had also checked with my local head rebuilding shop here and he said his experience with DNJ parts was good.  Of course, I should have done more research and have conversations with other well-known Toyota engine builders.
 
I know there are as many "opinions" as there are parts selection and ways to rebuild an engine.

In the words of Plato...  "Opinion is the medium between knowledge and ignorance.

Gnarls.  :blah:



« Last Edit: Feb 03, 2019, 05:27:52 AM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

cbeers

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1752 on: Feb 03, 2019, 06:20:39 AM »
sorry to hear about all of this gnarly. i know you put a lot of time, thought, money and effort into this.
I'm very interested in any quality issues with engnblgr products. I have their head/cam too but next to zero miles. I got it running and then tore down suspension etc and years passed    :gap:

i tossed the gaskets in favor of OEM...

CB

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1753 on: Feb 03, 2019, 08:08:56 AM »
sorry to hear about all of this gnarly.

Hey cbeers,

Thanks, I appreciate the empathy.  :beerchug:

Well… I was trying to keep myself out of the 100s of posts and threads on these forums that most of us have read over many years about the guys who rebuilt an engine and then had minor issues to major failures.

I *thought* I was doing everything right.

At this point, when the engine is torn down and inspected, my gut says there will be some defective parts (piston rings?) and improperly built head or defective parts (valve seats, cam?)

Since the valve lash went tight several times (I’m not sure why the valve lash would go tight. Doesn’t the lash typically go loose on these engines?), causing a misfire, I assume one or more exhaust valve may be burned.

I believe the choice of head on these engines is critical.  I dodged the expense of a head from LCE or 22RE Performance.  LCE wants $1,050 for their head with a cam, but I have to buy their rocker assembly at $500.  That makes the head alone at $1,550.  At the time I decided to start my rebuild, I didn’t have enough money in my budget to go that route.  Of course now, it’s an easy justifiable expense, and the “savings” is certainly NOT worth going through the time, money, and frustration of what I’m going through now.  There’s a reason why it takes Jim at 22RE Performance 40 hours to build an engine.  Assuming a factory 22 can go at least 200K miles, with the new high quality parts available for today’s rebuild it should make a rebuilt engine go to 200K+ miles.  For my 20,000 miles average miles driven per year, and conscientious maintenance, that would mean I should get 10 to 12 years out of an engine before a major rebuild.... or a basic head job.

Gnarls.



1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

emsvitil

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1754 on: Feb 03, 2019, 04:36:47 PM »
Gnarly, you need to start a thread on

"How NOT to rebuild an 22R"



 :smack:
Ed
SoCal
86 SR5 XtraCab
22RE  W56B
31x10.50R15

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1755 on: Feb 03, 2019, 07:23:47 PM »
Excuse Me but I believe We were promised some testing results?
Today even.
I am 1/5th of Perfect Fit
SqWADoosh [04:19 PM]: *sigh* I guess Chris is right and I just need to wait until I'm in a place where I have a tow rig and trailer before I get this caliber of truck
Mudder [08:28 PM]:   not try to be a jerk, but are you serious bestgen?
Prismo [06:11 PM]:   Done, time to relax or as Bestgen says....FREEDOM!
HogCanyonHopper [06:54 PM]:   I like my little rod. it gets the job done
H8PVMNT [03:30 PM]: I can go both ways.

Snowtoy

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1756 on: Feb 03, 2019, 07:51:05 PM »
Gnarly, you need to start a thread on

"How NOT to rebuild an 22R"



 :smack:

I think he kind of has............

JK, Gnarly, I think you got some poor quality parts and messed up something during the assembly.
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The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1757 on: Feb 04, 2019, 05:17:13 AM »
Gnarly, you need to start a thread on

"How NOT to rebuild an 22R"


Hey e...

Well... I will happily share my experience with anyone that is not an expert engine builder, that wants to get greasy doing a complete rebuild on a 22RE, what I would do differently!

I have learned too much too late.  I now have a list of "Do's :thumbs: and Don'ts"  :yikes:  when rebuilding a 22RE.

Gnarls.  :gap:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1758 on: Feb 04, 2019, 05:23:18 AM »
Excuse Me but I believe We were promised some testing results?
Today even.


Hi bgen...

Sorry... I didn't get the re-test done yesterday. 

Yesterday my morning started at about 4am.  I fed the kids, made a pot of coffee.  I stumbled into my computer room, with a full cup of coffee (cream & sugar, that's all) in my hand, stubbed my toe on my chair, put my coffee down on the desk on top of a roll of tape, it tipped over and spilled ALL OVER MY KEYBOARD, DESK, CALCULATOR, PAPERS, RAN DOWN ONTO THE FLOOR!!  That's how my Super Bowl day started.  After I got it all cleaned up, took my keyboard all apart, cleaned it, put it back together, I looked outside and it was pouring down raining!  At that point I figured something was telling me to sit down and not do anything.

So... I WILL do the re-test this Saturday.

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1759 on: Feb 04, 2019, 05:31:11 AM »
I think he kind of has............

JK, Gnarly, I think you got some poor quality parts and messed up something during the assembly.

Hey S...

Yeah... I gotta believe there is something wrong with some "parts".  Did I mess up the assembly?  :dunno:

That is definitely a possibility.  I did take extra care and lots of time with the assembly, verifying as I went along. 

BUT.... I've been known to "mess up" an oil change!!  :yikes:

Gnarls. :gap:


1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Snowtoy

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1760 on: Feb 04, 2019, 02:18:38 PM »
From the start you had oil leaks and consumption, valve issues, and now a bad HG, something went south had to be bad from the start with the machining you had done locally and/or with the assembly, it can't all be the parts, if it is, you would have to be the least lucky guy on the planet, well at least the least lucky Toyota owner on the planet. :gap: 
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1761 on: Feb 05, 2019, 07:49:11 AM »
From the start you had oil leaks and consumption, valve issues, and now a bad HG, something went south had to be bad from the start with the machining you had done locally and/or with the assembly, it can't all be the parts, if it is, you would have to be the least lucky guy on the planet, well at least the least lucky Toyota owner on the planet. :gap: 

Hey Snowtoy….

OIL LEAKS:  My oil leaks were at the input shaft on the tranny – I installed the oil seal backwards!  There was a slight coolant leak at one of the rubber hoses on the Idle Control Valve.  Later, I had a coolant leak at the heater hose to block.  No crankcase oil leaks.

On the valves:  Something didn’t sound right from the moment I fired the engine.  There was knock that was not right, so I had concerns from the beginning about the head.  The valve lash kept going tight at low mileage. That concerned me and seemed abnormal.

The head gasket:  The rocker cover gasket kit was junk, so if the head gasket has failued, I’m not totally surprised.  So, is the head gasket junk too?  Does the head have some issues that would cause a head gasket failure? I torqued the new head bolts per Tod at engnbldr.

The block and machine work:  I made a mistake by trusting the machine work.  I should have made the shop show me EXACTLY what was done, all specifications, tolerances, and measurements - including the boring and honing, and especially the RA on the hone.  My local machine shop has a good local reputation (been in business for 52 years!) and builds race engines and RV engines.  I toured the shop so I felt I had chosen a high quality shop to do the basic machine work on the block (.020” overbore, .006” on clean and deck) including magnaflux, sonic test, and everything balanced. They had the timing cover, pistons, rods & bushings, crank, pressure plate & fly wheel.

My bad luck:  Yep, I’d say that I had more bad luck than I deserved.

I won’t really know anything for sure until the engine is disassembled and inspected.

Gnarls. :blah:

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1762 on: Feb 07, 2019, 07:07:43 PM »
Hey Gnarls,  sometimes the machine shop does the incorrect RA for the rings they or you supply.  Chrome rings require a different RA than others, etc.  A head gasket, no matter who makes it can have defects that can fail right out of the box.  You'll spend a boat-load of coin having 22RE do a tear-down when you should probably just take the head off yourself, look at the cyl. walls and see if it looks like there might be a broken ring gouging the wall somewhere to go with the blown head gasket.  I'd change out the rings anyway, just to be sure, if the head gasket doesn't show a leak from an oil passage as well as a coolant passage :twocents:
'85 Xtra-cab, 4.5" Downey Off-Road lift, 12-15 KM2's on American Racing Baja's, Marlin's-4.88's & 4.7's, Downey Off-Road CAI, Marlin rear bumper & sliders

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1763 on: Feb 07, 2019, 08:21:06 PM »
Here we are 60 pages in on a rebuild of a 22re

I just have to do it. I cant help myself gnarls.










































3rz
83 long bed 2wd sas, 3rz, w56, duals with 4.7 rear, 4.88 elock front, spartan rear, 39.5 iroks
01 double cab hunting truck
06 tacoma street truck

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1764 on: Feb 08, 2019, 05:49:05 AM »
Hey Gnarls,  sometimes the machine shop does the incorrect RA for the rings they or you supply.  Chrome rings require a different RA than others, etc.  A head gasket, no matter who makes it can have defects that can fail right out of the box.  You'll spend a boat-load of coin having 22RE do a tear-down when you should probably just take the head off yourself, look at the cyl. walls and see if it looks like there might be a broken ring gouging the wall somewhere to go with the blown head gasket.  I'd change out the rings anyway, just to be sure, if the head gasket doesn't show a leak from an oil passage as well as a coolant passage :twocents:

Hey S,

Yeah… I could spend too much to find out what happened.  If I have 22REP build me a long block, I’d want to send them my engine anyway.  I could pull the engine, send Jim the rings and have him tell me what he thinks, since he suggested the oil consumption and low compression could be bad rings out of the box. :hammerhead:

I have given some serious thought to pulling the engine and doing my own tear down and diagnosis.  I don’t know that I can stand to park my truck and store it for another 2 or 3 years.  :sad2:

I plan to pull the rocker cover off again tomorrow or Sunday and do another test for bgen. :thumbs:

Do the oversized stainless steel valves tend to burn quicker than sodium filled? :dunno:

Gnarls. :inthedark:

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1765 on: Feb 08, 2019, 06:01:42 AM »
Here we are 60 pages in on a rebuild of a 22re

I just have to do it. I cant help myself gnarls.
3rz

Hey redneckcustoms13,

Well that conversion or swap seems pretty popular.  I think I can find lots of threads with lots of issues doing that swap.  Is it a good swap? Yeah. :yesnod:

I'm trying to keep my truck as original as reasonable.  Since my first 1986 Long Bed with a 22RE that I bought in 1986 ran so well, I'd like to get this truck and engine rebuilt with some minor to moderate enhancements to keep the truck as stock as possible.  It is in such incredibly good condition for a 33 year old Toyota truck.  If I were to actually do a complete engine swap, it would be to a V-8 (LS).  Gaining 40 HP with 3RZ engine just isn't worth the swap for me.  And with a 3RZ I don't know if I could do my own maintenance on it? :headscratch:

That's just think'n right now.  Things can always change. :gap:

Gnarls. :biggthumpup:

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1766 on: Feb 08, 2019, 07:05:26 AM »
A 3rz and 22r are nearly identical internally. 3rz has counter balance shafts and 4 valve per cylinder is the difference. The shafts can be deleted if someone decides to or for whatever reason they have an issue. I personally haven't seen issues. The 2rz does not have cb shafts and when torn down looks just like the internals of a 22r. The valves are bucket shimmed rather than the annoying rockers that tick. I only suggest the rz swap because I know how much you truly love this vehicle and want to keep it "original" how much better can you get than an engine that is 10 years newer and literally bolts in place of the original? I understand you want to keep the 22re because your first one treated you well.

Try think of it this way if you will. Do you make coffee in the morning with a percolator or do you have a normal coffee pot? Do you use a rotary dial telephone or do you have a modern touch screen smart phone?

Dont get me wrong a 22r is great. Just as a percolator is a great way to make coffee. With the modern technology that is available more power and less stress is among us. I embrace the power and obd2 capabilities of the rz engines. Darn a 22re and it's useless diagnostics counting blinks of the cel and using a paperclip to jump pins. Just my $.02 it may be worthless.  :gap:
83 long bed 2wd sas, 3rz, w56, duals with 4.7 rear, 4.88 elock front, spartan rear, 39.5 iroks
01 double cab hunting truck
06 tacoma street truck

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1767 on: Feb 08, 2019, 08:53:33 AM »
A 3rz and 22r .... I embrace the power and obd2 capabilities of the rz engines. Darn a 22re and it's useless diagnostics counting blinks of the cel and using a paperclip to jump pins. Just my $.02 it may be worthless.  :gap:

OK... I respect your opinion and it's not worthless to me!  So... I admit that I have not really looked heavily into a 3RZ swap.  I like the idea of a "bolt in" swap.  Can I hook up my AC unit?  How money does it cost to replace the "stuff" to bolt one into my truck?  I have to swap the ECU and wiring, right?  I believe that AZ Rocket down in Tucson area had to take the 4Runner to a Toyota shop to get the valve lash checked and adjusted.  Is that a typical maintenance requirement and how often do I have to do it?

I will have to read in detail Big Mike's post on this swap to educate myself.

I'll do some research on this swap and see what I find. :thumbs:

Gnarls. :blah:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1768 on: Feb 08, 2019, 09:16:15 AM »
The engine requires a modified pan to clear your ifs suspension but is available from toy only swaps. They also makes the engine mounts you need. The wiring isnt bad when you have the efi truck already. Just extend fuel lines. If you have a top plate style ac compressor you unbolt your top plate and bolt it to the one on the 3rz.

The Arizona guys didnt need to take it to a shop. I have done many 3rz valve shim adjustments and it isnt that hard.
83 long bed 2wd sas, 3rz, w56, duals with 4.7 rear, 4.88 elock front, spartan rear, 39.5 iroks
01 double cab hunting truck
06 tacoma street truck

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #1769 on: Feb 09, 2019, 08:04:29 AM »
One thing I noticed about the 3RZ is the peak torque number.  The specs I've seen show peak torque of about 177 lbs at 4,000  RPM.  At freeway cruise speed of between 75 and 80 MPH (3,000 to 3,200), my RPM is right in the middle of my peak torque in my 22RE. With my rebuild specs, my engine should be producing about 154 lbs of torque at 3,000 RPMs.

Of course right now it ain't produc'n didley!!!  :smack:

How many lbs of torque is the 3RZ producing at 3,000 RPMs?  :dunno:

Gnarls.  :spin:
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2019, 07:04:19 PM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

 
 
 
 
 

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