Topic: Questions about 3RZ swap??

[Volcom]

I'm at a crossroads on what I want to do with my 84 4Runner.  It currently has a 22R that is dead and needed rebuilt.  I scored a supercharger for free for it and was kinda thinking of coverting to propane.  The more and more I thought about it, the more I realized that I need to keep it gas.  If this thing was a trail rig, it would be propaned in a second.  But, I need it to be drivable to the trails and across the state without worrying about finding a place to fill up a propane tank.

That brings me to swapping either a 22RE or the 3RZ.  I can't seem to find a decent, local 22RE here in CO that's reasonable in price.  I've even considered buying an 86-89 and SAS'ing it but for the price, it seems like I could swap engines for cheaper.  After reading all the 3RZ swap threads, it sounds like that's the motor I need in my 4Runner to make it drivable with 36-37 inch tires up the mountain passes here in CO and still keep it light weight.

Since my starting point is a 4Runner that was carb'ed, I'm kinda scared (actually, really scared    ) about the wiring.  I don't know how much different the wiring
harness is in a 22R compared to an 85-89 that has the 22RE? 

Motor mounts, how tough are they to build?  I think I could probably fab up something but if anybody has any great ideas, I'm all ears.

Does anybody have a detailed thread about the 3RZ swap other than the couple that are on the Marlin Board?

Thanks for all the help
Aaron

[Volcom [OP]]

Actaully, how is the 5RZ swap?  Looks like the prices for the motors are similar on car-part.com.  Anybody have a 3.4 swap in their 84-89 4Runner or truck?

[hudlenutz]

I think off road solutions has a tech writeup on the 3.4L conversion.  They sell some stuff related to that conversion also.  I think it's mostly directed toward folks who had the 3.slow, because the motor mounts match up. 

With the 3.4L, you'd need a R150 or R151.  With the 2.7, you can use the W56 or the G?  You could also consider the taco tranny, but since you're already solid axle, you'd want a tranny that keeps the transfer case output on the passenger side.

Both motors can be turbo'ed or supercharged. 

BigMike's Big Project shows the build pretty well. 
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=4401.0

Also check out the install on Marlin's
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=13795.0

I think there were a few others.  Try a search on Bevin, TacoRunner?

Since you've got a 4cyl frame, you'd need to fab motor mounts either way.  The best might be to buy an entire donor vehicle with an engine that runs, and just convert everything over. 

[hudlenutz]

I'm thinking the 3rz is 150 hp and the 5rz is 190hp.

[Volcom [OP]]

Thanks for the reply hudlenutz.  I wasn't thinking before I posted the reply about the 5RZ, I don't want to have to buy an R series tranny.  I want to stick with the W56 that I've got in the garage. 

Looks like ORS sells a wiring harness to make it easier to convert a 22R to 22RE for $400.  Would something like that be helpful in my case even though I am going to be using most of the 3RZ harness?

[BigMike]

I'm thinking the 3rz is 150 hp and the 5rz is 190hp.

That's correct, the older 3RZ's are 155 HP / 177 Tq (1995-2004) and the newer VVTi version is 163 HP / 183 Tq (2005+)

I have raced a Turbo 22R-TE, a 3.0 V6, and a 3.4 V6 up the same steep grade on HWY168 up to Shaver Lake, and I can pull all over the Turbo and the 3.0, and slowly distance myself from the 3.4. Seriously. When you think about it, the 3.4 only has 25% more horsepower than the 2.7, and that's apparently not enough to cover the extra weight of the newer trucks (as my truck only weighs about 3300 lbs).

As for the 3RZ swap, I could go on for days talking about this topic.

But I want to scare you first. It will cost you roughly $1500 to complete the swap, if not more. Figure about $800 - $1200 for an engine complete with all wiring harnesses and ecu, and an extra $300 - $500 or so for the misc things you will need during the conversion.

As for wiring, the 22R-E would be much easier since you won't have to do any wiring. Your chassis and body are already setup for the 22R-E harness, so you can just basically keep the looming intact and just install it into your truck (as I see you have a 2nd gen truck). The hardest thing would be working on the interior and ignition. You would have to remove your dash and place the new looming into place. I am talking about having a complete 100% harness with all sensors and everything, including the ignition..

As for the 3RZ, I have complete notes for the 1st gen and 3rd generations of the 3RZ (1995-1997 & 2001(?)-2004), I just need to get them up online for everyone to enjoy..

But even with the wiring notes, it will be a lot of wiring and soldering and heat shrinking to do the job correctly. I will not pretend to tell people that this is a cake job. Even for me, sure it's cake because I've done it a couple of times, but its still gonna take me a couple of days to get it finished.

But let me tell you, the rewards from the 3RZ are OUT STANDING. Sometimes when I've raced a moderately modified 22R-E setup, I feel like "If I loose this race, it's going to be REALLY embarrassing considering all of the work that Ive done" but then I just realize, how could someone build a NA 22R-E engine that could out perform a 22R-TE engine? NO WAY! At least nothing that would be a daily driver, it would be some special machine for sure, and then I remember, well geeze! my 3RZ IS BONE STOCK!!!!! What if I put the same amount of work into my engine! Holy Crap- So It is soooo amazing to have a completely stock engine, thats completely stock Toyota reliable, makes over 20 mpg on the highway, and has more power than both the Turbo 22R and the 3.0 V6, and it is all so Light weight, works with a lightweight drivetrain, has NO clutter under the hood, and is smog legal (here in Cali).

If I had to do this again, I would never even think about anything else than the 3RZ. Not in a million years.

In fact, this last weekend we just took Bevin's truck out for a test drive for the first time, and this is the 2nd fastest 3RZ truck Ive driven. His truck is really fast!! And he is so happy with the 3RZ that he has already bought a 1963 Toyota Stout, and we are looking for yet another 3RZ to swap into the Stout and convert it to a 4WD. Pretty cool stuff man

[Volcom [OP]]

I found a 2000 3RZ with low that's somewhat local here in CO for 1200 with the wiring harness.  I forgot to ask about the ECU     I'm guessing it will be a couple hundred more.  Is that a decent price?  Am I going to have trouble with the swap since you only have notes on the 1st and 3rd Gen 3RZ's  ?

I hate to sound dumb about the wiring but does the interior stuff (lights, heater, fans, stereo) have to be run with the 3RZ harness or can they stay 22R?  Is it easier to take both harnesses and make one or just try and place the 3RZ in the truck next to the 22R?  Do I end up taking my current harness completely out of the truck?

I'm also kinda worried about the fuel lines and gas tank.  Exhaust wise, I'm not too conserned.  I've got a buddy that owns an exhaust shop and he does some good work.

Cost-wise doesn't really bother me.  I have added what it was going to take to make my free supercharger work, rebuilt the 22R, and add propane.  It was going to be around $1500.  I figured that I might as well look into the 3RZ swap for that price.

Do you think the 3RZ will be enough for a heavy 4Runner, loaded down with tools and trail spares and camping gear?  I'm pretty sure it would but I figured I'd ask.

Looks like I've got some more research to do before I buy anything.   

Thanks for the help BigMike!!

[BigMike]

Hey guys, I came across this post again because I just posted some info on pirates, and thanks to my buddy Lyu, apparently the 3RZ was only used for 10 years.

The VVTi 163 hp engine is not a 3RZ. It is still a 2.7l, but it is a different engine..

Also the 3RZ is rated at 150hp, not 155, but for some reason that # keeps popping into my mind. I like to think that my engine is somewhere around 155-160 with the mods I've done. All I can say is that is kicks ass and that's what I want from my rig.

Later
BigMike

[Volcom [OP]]

Any update BigMike on your wiring notes?  I know you're pretty busy with school now but you've got some curious minds trying to patiently waiting 

I'm kinda stuck in terms of what I'm going to do.  I've got a 2 car garage but it really only fits one and my wife's Mountaineer gets it.  I don't really want to work on it outside next to the garage in the cold.  I could roll it in and out every time I want to work on it but once I get to where there's wiring hanging out everywhere, moving it might be kinda tough.

[h0nke]

For swapping 22R to RE I am going with a SDS kit:

www.sdsefi.com

Its stand alone and makes a very clean install. Eliminates the retarded toyota MAF too. This setup is completely programmable, unlike stock RE ECM. With this setup you could add a blower or turbo and actaully get it to run properly (custom programming with the controller).

If you want more info PM me I have been really studiyng this system.