Topic: Supra Tranny overhaul- attn Marlin

[reklund5]

Marlin-

This is a bit off topic, but I've got a 3rd generation Supra in addition to my 84pickup.  Recently, due to heavy upgrades and mods to the engine and an upgraded clutch, I managed to break the R154 transmission in the Supra.  I broke a thrust washer, and lost a bearing.  I rebuilt the tranny myself, using Toyota parts ( I'm a Toyota mechanic at a local dealership), and it worked great for like 3500 miles.  After a little stoplight racing, the same thing happened, and now I've got a borrowed tranny in the Supra while I figure out what to do.  I don't shift hard and have NEVER side-stepped the clutch or anything, so I'm a little confused as to why it broke.  I've heard many reports of 700 HP going thru these trannys with no problems, and I'm only pushing 450.  So here's the questions-

1.  Do you have access to upgraded thrust washers for an R series transmission?

2.  Would you be willing to rebuild my Supra tranny (It's an R154)and if so, what would it cost me?  What does shipping usually run?

[Marlin]

Was it the 1st gear thrust washer with the square cut grove that failed? And the center mainshaft bearing?
When you assembled the trans, did you grease the thrust washer pin and carefully press the mainshaft togeather? No hammering allowed!!!

I do not have a upgraded thrust washer. The factory washer is a good heat treated piece.
However, I have seen these washers wear away from lack of oil at very high RPM's

If this trans was just rebuilt with new parts, I would gladly go thur it and Marlin blueprint it. Cost should be around $350.00 plus  hard parts? and the one bearing. I also offer a heavy duty machined steel mainshaft retainer plate (probably one of your main problems)for $35.00

Weights around 100 #   UPS $55-65.00
I buy rubbermaid toughtotes from Walmart, add a plywood floor, pack the trans and ship.

Marlin
Give me a call @ (559) 252-7295

[Greg55_99]

Hey Marlin,
    I've heard of the same problems with the R154.  I've copied some info from a site that has something about it.  Can you comment on this stuff?  I'm really curious about it.

Greg

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Toyota R154 Specifications and Details

The R154 is made by Toyota, Japan. It's a 5 speed gearbox (5 forward gears + reverse). As with most Toyota driveline components, the R154 is of quality design and construction. Unfortunately as always seems to be the case with modern technology, there is always an Achilles heal.

The R154 is a conventional 5-speed gearbox, with 5 forward gears and a straight-cut reverse gear. The reason for the strength of the gearbox is plain to see even by the naked eye. The external casing and the gears themselves are credibly sized for a performance-oriented gearbox.

The weak point, however, is the first gear thrust washer. Being of a cast construction, this part is prone to failure if the box is maltreated. In most known cases this is a result of one (or a combination of!) three things:

* abuse or misuse of the gearbox
* when the gearbox is used with a high-clamp and/or button clutch
* big-horsepower applications

The easiest fix for this weakness is to lighten up on the gearbox and treat it with respect. For gearbox owners with less self-control, the best option is to have the gearbox broken down and reassembled with a new thrust washer made of chromoly for added strength.

The part itself is quite inexpensive, however the damage it can cause in the event of failure is quite humbling. The first gear bearing takes the brunt of this failure due to being located in front of the thrust washer.
             
In more severe failures, or if the car continues to be driven after a failure, one or more of the gears will need to be replaced. First gear alone has been priced at $550 Australian dollars. Certainly not a cheap exercise, and one better avoided."

 
http://www.jzgte.com/~nickc/gallery/thrustwasher

[Marlin]

I have also seen wear and in severe cases failure. I feel this is due to excessive 1st gear end play. (I dont recall these trans having a recall for thrust washer fauilers). Was the 1/2nd hub adjusted? Was the 5th driven gear adjusted?, (thrust washer end play)
I recall having a failuer that was cased when I pressed the mainshaft togeather, the thrust washer fell down and the antirotation pin cracked the washer when it was pressed togeather.
Upon assembly, Did you take extra care and grease the pin and washer?
Sorry for all the questions. I take pride that I spend time to blueprint all my trannys!

Marlin

[reklund5 [OP]]

Marlin-

I checked at work today, and there was never a recall for the R series trannys used in the Supra, but the ones in the 4x4's were recalled.  Something to do with sales figures (# of vehicles on the road)

It was the first gear thrust washer that was damaged, as well as the center mainshaft bearing.  I also screwed up one of the clips when it went.  

The last post states the transmission is damaged by three things: abuse/misuse of the gearbox, a high-clamp clutch, and big horsepower applications.  I believe that I've got all three of these things going on, despite my best attempts not to abuse the gearbox.

When I rebuilt the trans, I went by-the-book, start to finish.  I mic'ed and checked everything just like the book said, and adjusted everything to spec.  As I said, it worked beautifully for about 3500 miles, and then broke again, probably due to my clutch and my right foot.  I did manage to break the thrust washer the same way you did during re-assembly, and had to wait another week for a replacement.  Yes, I did grease the pin and the washer, and used the Toyota trans overhaul adaptors for our shop press, so not to damage the shaft.  

At this point, I'm sure the ACT clutch I've got is partly to blame, as well as the highly modded engine.  I need to get mine fixed soon, as my "loaner" tranny is needed back at it's home.  I've not yet torn my broken tranny apart to see what I broke the second time, but I'm assuming it's the same parts, because the tranny failed in exactly the same way.  Is there any way we could get a thrust washer machined out of a stronger material?  Where would I go for such a piece?  I'm looking to send my tranny out to you next month, and would like to have everything necessary for you all at once.  

Thanks!
Ryan
(my marlin crawler in the Truck is AWESOME!  I'll be testing it out at the Chile Challenge later this month in Las Cruces, NM)

[Marlin]

When I was building front axles with 35 spline d60 axles, I had 35 spline detroit locker side gears made of an exotic alloy by a machine shop in Washington state. I will call him tomorrow and ask if he could do a small run for me. I already make a heavy duty center bearing retainer plate. It sells for $35.00

I was not aware of any R 4x4 trans recalls.

Thanks for spending the time to follow the factory procedures.

MC

[Greg55_99]

Marlin, put me on the list for two of these thrust washers if you get them fabricated.  I have a couple of R154's I need "toughened" up.

Greg

[Marlin]

Sorry for the late post, I was in Reno over the weekend for the California 4WD Association convention and exposition.

Last wed, Feb 11, I sent a badly worn washer, and a v/good one with an output shaft to my machinest.
We are going to test its composition and hardness, and see what can be done to inprove its performance.

Will post an update tomorrow.

MC

[reklund5 [OP]]

Schweet!  you never cease to amaze me!

thanks Marlin!

Ryan

[Marlin]

First gear thrust washer  33348-35010   $17.33 list
I am still waiting for the estimate-----------------

[reklund5 [OP]]

Any word yet??  

I'm headed out to 'Cruces for the Chile Challenge...back on sunday!  

-Ryan

[williamb82]

im also interested in the thrust washer(as are lots of other supra owners im sure). ive busted many w58's and stock lsd's in my supra. currently running a r154 and about to install a truetrac lsd this weekend. my current r154 prolly wont last very long and my spare is being pulled apart for a rebuild before it goes in and it would be nice to eleminate and possible future problems, and you guys seem to have that nailed down pretty good.
william
p.s. keep up the good work

[reklund5 [OP]]

Marlin-

Any news on this yet-  My loaner Tranny needs to go back to its owner soon.

Thanks,
Ryan

[Marlin]

Well, got the quote---------------------
I didnt want to tell you

Around $47.00 each

That is waaay out of line.

After getting it back, I have now sent the thrust washer to the orginal manufacture in Japan for a quote.

Will let you know.......

[84runner]

Marlin has the hook ups oh ya  

[redline814]

Hi folks!

In my search for a R154 rebuilt kit, I found this thread.  I own a Lexus IS300 and swaped in a Toyota Supra R154 tranny (replaced the W55).  I want to build up the R154.  I am also interested in buying this thrust washer.  You can add me to you list.

mervine@erols.com

Thanks,
Mark

[Marlin]

Thanks for your intrest in the upgraded thrust washers. I am still waiting for the quote from the orginal manufacture.

Marlin

[Race Bred]

I will also buy a set or two! Same with many supra owners. This is a common problem for people with high output motors and also people who like to power shift . I’m not sure if there are any made for the r-150/51 but I am under the impression that it is the same design as the r-154. Check out http://www.supramania.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=7528&highlight=thrust+washer this is a recent thread... If you can get some made and make it known I'm sure these will sell like hot cakes. Add me to the list also (2nd tranny in 3 months is due for some TLC)

Eric
fss_611@msn.com

[Race Bred]

If you would like me to make an interest thread on the supra forums just shoot me an e-mail and I will. I really want to see this product completed. I’m sure if funds were an issue there would be more than enough people to throw down on a group buy.

[reklund5 [OP]]

Any word yet Marlin?

[Race Bred]

ttt   8)

[reklund5 [OP]]

Marlin-  just got news of another broken thrust washer...any word yet?  HELP!!

thanks for all the work!
Ryan

[Paul_Elbisser]

Hey you ricers, leave our Marlin alone. We still need our FART case !

 I hope you know what you started. Marlin is on a quest, like if you tell him it can't be fixed. Or the rear case will never hold up uder the torque of a dual case setup.

 I don't have a Supra, trans, but I have a Supra engine. I may need a FART soon.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

[reklund5 [OP]]

Ricers!  Hey!

I've got a rockcrawler too...and I bet my 7MGTE puts out more power than yours, so there

[reklund5 [OP]]

Marlin- 

Is it safe to send my Supra trans out for a rebuild yet?

[reklund5 [OP]]

Marlin-

So what's the word on that upgraded thrust washer??

[Marlin]

I will once again ask my importer where the thrust washers are.
His last excuse was that they were waiting for the proper material?
Will post the latest update ASAP.

Marlin

[reklund5 [OP]]

Any word yet?

[Race Bred]

iirc Toyota can get them for 25 each. I would love to see a set made. Go to www.supraforums.com and search "thrust washer" in the mkIII section... There is plenty of interest. Try Champion/Jay Marks Toyota or Elmhurst Toyota (supraforums sponsors) they offer decent prices on oem parts.

[reklund5 [OP]]

I know Toyota can get them ( I work as a technician at a Toyota Dealership)- I've rebuilt mine once already with toyota parts.  My damn Supra makes too much power, and now I need upgraded parts.  A silly problem to have, I understand, but annoying nonetheless. 

Thanks for the link tho,

Ryan