Military Careers

[jimbo74]

If the job I am trying to get right now falls through, I will soon be looking @ joining the military. Not sure about benefits or branch yet, but I want everyones opinion here first. I know if I go into the recruiter's officeeveryone will be on me to go with them, and know from first hand accounts of friends, that they all promise you great things and very few deliver.

I am going to school for firefighter, and that is ultimately what I want to be doing as a lifelong career. As far as that goes, I am open to Paramedic training or firefighting @ the military level as an MOS. I plan on only signing for the military for 2 years. I have a young daughter and I dont want to be gone all the time.

I know there are tests i need to take for admittance, etc.

I have a good grasp of mechanical skills as well.

[RokCrawlinToy]

If you want to go FIRE, get your EMT-P/ Paramedic. That is the fastest way in.
If you go to the Military, whatever Branch. Make sure you get the job you want before you sign anything even if they say the job they are trying to get you is just like the one you want. So, do your research on MOS(s) you like.
I was in the U.S.M.C. and did a little time as a Vol. FF/EMT

[BLACKDOG]

AF is known to treat you the best.    I'm an AF brat, and weve lived in some pretty good places.  We spent a year in Ft. Leavenworth, got to know a lot of army folk there.  They claimed that they aren't treated as well, and their housing and such is subpar compared to the AF. 

No one take this as offense, I'm just stating my experience. 

Have you considered the reserves? there is a thought there, and the AF has firefighters in the reserves.


Oh yeah, with the recruiters, its not all lies, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is, but they are usually fairly decent.  you just gotta take everythign they say with a grain of salt.

[kneedownnate]

Ok, I don't know how to say this, but my boss was in the navy as a CV?  No ship stuff, mostly building and mechanical.  He loved it.  I'll ask him again tomorrow for ya.

[mudguts]

The Navy has the best fire fighting program. If you choose the military route, choose wisely. Make sure it's something you can carry over into your civilian life. The Army, by far has the most MOS's to choose from. Check it out    http://www.us-army-info.com/pages/branches.html. I was a bulk fuelman, MOS 1391 in the Marine Reserves. It helped me get on with ConocoPhillips as a petroleum pipeline operator, that was a good job until I found something better   
  Marine MOS list    http://usmilitary.about.com/od/marines/l/blmarinejobs.htm

[blackdiamond]

I have never been in the Navy, but I do work in a Navy shipyard and nearly 100% of all sailors know the exact number of days until they get out.  It must be because they love being in the Navy 

NEVER
AGAIN
VOLUNTEER
YOURSELF

[BLACKDOG]

Jimbo, once again, have you considered the reserves?  you might wanna look into that.

[guywithuglyyota]

I cannot stress to you enough the differences between the services!  Im just past my six year mark in the Air Force, and we have the best quality of life hands down. Im sure there are a few exceptions on the Navy side of the house, however if you want to have a life that closely matches civilian life I would go AF.

The reserves is also a great option, you can still get the GI bill and you are still getting some great training, without the worry or stress of bing moved around.

Not to get into your personal life, but you mentioned you have a daughter, if you are a single father or mother even, the Military (last I checked) will not accept you.

Dont quote me on this, however active duty military needs a deployable Airman, and if you are a single father this greatly effects things when you are asked to deply for the now 4 month rotations. The logistics of how your daughter will be taken care of while your in training, and deployed are something to consider.

If you are married, then nevermind, your good to go   

The firefighters I have met and benn freinds with in the Military all love there Jobs, and usually are set up pretty well once they leave the service. Im a mechanic on F-15 fighters, which means Im stuck to the maintenanace world, and flightline management etc....

Firefighting is highly competitive, and prior Military, with EMT certifications will place you one step ahead of most that apply once you get out.
Keep in mind that it may take up to three years to aquire all of your special certs through the AF. It has taken myself five years to attain my 7-level (craftsman) skill level.

I have also just signed up for another six years, crazy huh!  ha ha  You will find that most people who whine and pregnant dog about military life, have the same complaints most civilians do, crappy pay, bad supervision etc....

It truly is a good life if you take advantage of all it has to offer. I have recieved over $40,000 in special bonuses, im about to buy my first house (zero down Veterans loan)
And im only 24. Not bragging but just putting things into perspective for ya. I have not deployed in five yars in fact! Iraq???  Never been, only Kuwait and other countries on pretty much a military sponsored vacation.


Geeze I sound like a recruiter        which brings me to my last point.  Make sure you get a guaranteed Job. It is posible for them to promise you one career, and change there minds before you realize it, your a cop in the air force pulling gate duty in the Alaskan winter (not fun)
They do have contracts where they can promise you a job so ask about it if you decide AF.

And the recruiters are full of crap, always. They only really know about the Jobs they had before they got there special duty position. Ask people who actually do the Jobs, its the best     you will get.

[jimbo74]

although i love my daughter very much, she doesnt actually live with me... there is no court ordered visitation or naything like that, no order for me to pay child support. the motehr and i get along pretty well, and we wont drag jen through bs.....  jen lives with her mom basically, and i go and visit.. i have talked to her and she is ok with me going into the military.

the reserves was thought about, but that might actually be more chance of being sent to war than being in the service fulltime, and the $ isnt that great, sure its great for that one weekend a month and 2 weeks a year, however, i would not be able to sustain a constant paycheck with the reserves, well it will be constant, but not to sustain everyday life....

the issue right now is i need to get a job, and i need to get my life on track and quit being so dependent on my parents.... if i could make some extra $ too, that would help out with saving for the future, and contributing more to my daughter. as it is now, i am pretty lucky and only pay for 1/2 daycare each month, all otehr expenses are paid by jen's mom

im 23, not in that great of shape, but am strong, 6'3" tall and about 250-260 pounds

[havik]

iam in the airforce and have been in for 5 years
so far i have had a good time in the airforce BUT its not for everyone. for the AF you got to be married if you got a kid. in my opinion if you got something going for you on the outside i would steer away from military. civilian life has so much freedom which is priceless. i would say make the military last resort. and its all what you make it
attitude is everything
i know people who hate it hear on the central coast of cali where there is no traffic, low crime, and NICE year round weather.......... and i also know people who have had great times in the desert which is pretty sucky;tents, heat, dust, mud, minimal sex, no freedom, all that stuff that sux
either way good luck what ever you do

[jimbo74]

the whole reason i am looking to the military is that it is a steady paycheck with job security....

my daughters mom said if i dont get my butt in gear that she doesnt want to be with me, because she is having a hard enough time supporting her and jen, she cant support me as well. i do see her point in that, and im poor, i borrow $ form my parents all the time jsut to meet my bills, and it sucks pretty much.... it would be nice to have $ to fix my truck when it breaks or take a gal out tot he movies or go wheeling sometimes, or whatever.... but being poor, that stuff doesnt happen much......

[guywithuglyyota]

Well it sounds like you have almost  made up your mind. Keep in mind that I think you may have to give the mother 100% custody in order for atleast the AF to consider you. But agian I am not a recruiter so dont quote me.
Your gonna have to lose some LBS. When I came in they had some formula, height vs weight etc....  your a tall guy so you should be ok eiether way its not a big deal.

Yes there is TONS of job security but keep in mind you will be starting off with a very very weak paycheck. Just search for the 2006 military paychart to get an idea of the before taxes bi-weekly income and housing allowances if applicable.

You will live in a dormitory for atleast 2 1/2- 4 years depending on what base you ar stationed at and how quickly you make rank. That can be a tough life sometimes, unless you like to party etc...

Some may consider the Military a last resort and some may not. If you are truly having a hard time making ends meet it might be an option but it sounds like your problem is temporary......the Military is a commitment and once you riase your right hand your in for 4 years or so. No turning back really.

If you want this sounds cheesy...but make a list... and divide it in two, one side are the pros of the military, the other side are the cons of staying a civilian. It might help you make that big decision.

[Rocksurfer]

I was Army, but after watching my nephew's career in the Marine's I'd say go and be an MP in the Marine's. He has had quite the life, started as an MP, homocide detective, presidential guard, etc., etc. and at the moment is a counter terrorism intelligence (haha) recruiter, has travelled the world. He is a lifer for sure and has loved every minute.

[blackdiamond]

You can be a government worker and have the same steady paycheck and job security that the military offers, but without the contract.  I work in a Navy shipyard and the job security is pretty good.

You might look around your area and see what type of government type positions are available.  It can be as simple as being a painter or mechanic in the maintanence departments, as long as it is a non-contracted position.

[gedean]

I'm in the Marines and I wouldn't be happy any where else, but that doesn't mean the Marines, or even the military is the right thing for you.

The pay and benifits (which seems to be your main focus) are pretty much the same across the board regardless of service.  I caution you that if that is the only reason you want to join you might want to rethink your options.  With the "War on Terror" in progress you stand a good possibility of being deployed somewhere you might not want to go.  The service you choose and the MOS you select may also have an impact on where you go, and the length of your stay.  The Army typically prefers 1 year rotations the others... six months. 

You will need to talk to the recruiters about length of enlistment, as things may have changed in the last eight years, but I doubt you will get a firefighter/ paramedic MOS during a two year term.  The length of the schools that you would go to phrohibit this.  To get a paramedic MOS you may even have to go longer than 4. 

You will also need to dig into whether or not the training you recieve is really tranferable to civilian fire fighting.  For instance a basic Navy Corpsman (medic) is not qualified as a civilian Paramedic, nor is a basic Army Medic (to my knowledge).  To get a cert. that would carry over you would have to go through the 18 Delta program (Army/Navy Special Forces Medic).  The Air Force Para-Rescue Program will also get you your national cert. as a Paramedic.  These are not quick or easy programs however. 

Another thing to consider is whether or not the FD that you want to ultimatly work at considers your MOS.  They may only give you you points for military service.  Some FDs operate their selection process in this manner.

Here are a few things that you might want to keep in mind when you talk to the recruiters.

College funds (outside the GI-Bill)  - all services have them they basically provide extra money for college in additon to the GI-Bill.  These can be used to help support yourself as well as pay bills for schools like fire fighter school, not just 4 year colleges.

Signing bonuses - many MOSs (including some you might not think would have it) offer a signing bonus payable upon completion of your MOS school.

Open contract does not mean you have all the options open to you.  If you go in as an "open contract" that means that they can put you wherever they want, doing whatever they want.

Ask for a specific duty station if you know of one.  It might be preferable to not be stationed in 29 Palms and sweat your a$$ off every day.

Like 4LOWx2 said the recruiters don't know anything about what it is like to be a Motor Transport guy if they were an admin paper pusher, and vice versa.  Unless they did the job, all they are telling you is what you want to hear.  If the job was that great don't you think they would have tried to change their MOS to the one they are talking about.

They may tell you that once you are in you can change your MOS to another one, nope not in less that 4 years.

If possible talk to more than one recruiter from the same service, and ask them both questions, see if they give you the same answers. 

[BLACKDOG]

although i love my daughter very much, she doesnt actually live with me... there is no court ordered visitation or naything like that, no order for me to pay child support. the motehr and i get along pretty well, and we wont drag jen through bs.....  jen lives with her mom basically, and i go and visit.. i have talked to her and she is ok with me going into the military.

the reserves was thought about, but that might actually be more chance of being sent to war than being in the service fulltime, and the $ isnt that great, sure its great for that one weekend a month and 2 weeks a year, however, i would not be able to sustain a constant paycheck with the reserves, well it will be constant, but not to sustain everyday life....

the issue right now is i need to get a job, and i need to get my life on track and quit being so dependent on my parents.... if i could make some extra $ too, that would help out with saving for the future, and contributing more to my daughter. as it is now, i am pretty lucky and only pay for 1/2 daycare each month, all otehr expenses are paid by jen's mom

im 23, not in that great of shape, but am strong, 6'3" tall and about 250-260 pounds

The money isn't all the great in the military either, especially as a strarting out enlisted guy.  I gurantee you can make more $$ doing a gov't job, painting or something like that as a city employee.  Also, just because your daughter isn't living with you, it is still your kid, unless you give her up 100% and even that may not work   The military frons heavily on people joining up to get away from "responsibilities" (unwanted kids)  Not saying that is whay you are doing, I know its not, but that is how they will see it.

as for fitness, here are some hight weight charts

Army
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/army/l/blmaleweight.htm

Navy
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/navy/l/blweight.htm

Marines
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/marinejoin/l/blintweightmale.htm

I do't beleive the AF uses a height/weight chart anymore, I think they've gone to a different test.

also, as gedean said, make sure you MOS will allow you to use your military trainging in the civilian world.  I've had several people go through my fire classes, that had firefighter training, and medical training, who had to start compltely over, because it didn't transfer over. 

If I were you, I'd look for city position, and continue your schooling.  If you work for the city, you can get decent pay, and benefits, and it will be a plus when you test ofr firefighter in that city, if you're already working for the city.

[RHG]

Jim I am in the reserves right now and who ever told you that your chancs of being deployed are greater being in the reserves is smoking something. The reserves is just that...the back up. Our active duty guys go out first and if they need a spot filled(highly unlikely, we fight for a chance to go over there cause you make $$$) then the reserves fill in. I went to basic July 04 and have been on orders since then. You can do as much or as little as you want when it comes to the reserves. Just do your one weekend a month and 15 days of annual tour if you want or you can do like me and bug them for orders to be an active reservist. You get payed the same as the active. The money really isnt that bad. Right now as a E-4 I am recieving basic pay and housing allowance which adds up to roughly $1300 every two weeks. Id highly recommend the reserves. Treat the recruiters like a car salesman... dont let them talk you into something different. Hold firm and dont be afraid to walk out. They will be calling you back within 24hours. I got my exact job I wanted, enlistment bonus, and two stripes. Like 4Lowx2 said, its very benificial if you take avantage of what you have offered. Also you can get your EMT/Paramedic by being a reserve firefighter and then got to school with your GI Bill. The active duty(AF) makes you wait till you have been in for 3 years. Alrigh enough rambling. I hope you make the right decision and get lots of benefits out of it. Good luck

[Rocksurfer]

Jim I am in the reserves right now and who ever told you that your chancs of being deployed are greater being in the reserves is smoking something. The reserves is just that...the back up. Our active duty guys go out first and if they need a spot filled(highly unlikely, we fight for a chance to go over there cause you make $$$) then the reserves fill in. I went to basic July 04 and have been on orders since then. You can do as much or as little as you want when it comes to the reserves. Just do your one weekend a month and 15 days of annual tour if you want or you can do like me and bug them for orders to be an active reservist. You get payed the same as the active. The money really isnt that bad. Right now as a E-4 I am recieving basic pay and housing allowance which adds up to roughly $1300 every two weeks. Id highly recommend the reserves. Treat the recruiters like a car salesman... dont let them talk you into something different. Hold firm and dont be afraid to walk out. They will be calling you back within 24hours. I got my exact job I wanted, enlistment bonus, and two stripes. Like 4Lowx2 said, its very benificial if you take avantage of what you have offered. Also you can get your EMT/Paramedic by being a reserve firefighter and then got to school with your GI Bill. The active duty(AF) makes you wait till you have been in for 3 years. Alrigh enough rambling. I hope you make the right decision and get lots of benefits out of it. Good luck

Your duty activation is in the mail, rotation is the name of the game. There are lots of active reservists in both Afganastan and Iraq that are coming to the end of their active duty requirement and those are even getting extended so that they didn't have to go through the expense of rotating troops, and those extensions are almost done now too. I am assuming that the plan would be to reduce troops to make it look like things are going better than they really are so some of the rotation will be to downsize by not deploying more troops to replace them but there will be a point that replacement is required. Also did you know that a reserve unit is the main unit for any problems in the Korea's? If it goes boom over there again a reserve unit will be the 1st responder. Active duty recruitment is down, way down so how do you think they are going to make that up, reserves. About the only way you'll avoid going is if your job and your unit has no useful purpose. Unless you are a Marine and then it doesn't matter what you do when they need boots. The Marine's riflemen first.......

[*FFC*]

I have never been in the Navy, but I do work in a Navy shipyard and nearly 100% of all sailors know the exact number of days until they get out.  It must be because they love being in the Navy 

NEVER
AGAIN
VOLUNTEER
YOURSELF

that's what my daddy always said, and he served 4 years 

[Rocksurfer]

that's what my daddy always said, and he served 4 years 

I wish I'd never left now. I didn't understand until I screwed up my foot that it is all just a game when your non-com would get into your Now commissioned officers are as serious as a heart-attack but once I couldn't perform my duty they threw me in the office to serve out my term and it was a whole new world. I was required to keep my foot elevated at all times and my sargent with a captain came in and I was sitting at his desk with my foot up and the captain started his usual yelling and screaming then demanded 20, my sarg was kinda standing behind him silently laughing and almost died when I denied his request by saying "I'm sorry sir I cannot give you 20.

[*FFC*]

I wish I'd never left now. I didn't understand until I screwed up my foot that it is all just a game when your non-com would get into your Now commissioned officers are as serious as a heart-attack but once I couldn't perform my duty they threw me in the office to serve out my term and it was a whole new world. I was required to keep my foot elevated at all times and my sargent with a captain came in and I was sitting at his desk with my foot up and the captain started his usual yelling and screaming then demanded 20, my sarg was kinda standing behind him silently laughing and almost died when I denied his request by saying "I'm sorry sir I cannot give you 20.

I'da paid to see that 

[Rocksurfer]

I'da paid to see that 

It was hysterical, he yelled for me to get my foot off the desk my reply, " Sorry sir I cannot move my foot". He started yelling at my Sarge to do something about my insubordination and my Sarge replied, "Sorry sir I cannot do that".  Sorry can't post what the captain said next. He was pissed wanted sarge to find something for me to do. Finally we enlightened him that I was basically a cripple and was under Dr.s orders a Lieutenant Colonel to just sit there and do nothing so my foot would heal and then they were going to release me so I would not permanently injure my foot and that if he wanted to discuss it go speak with him.


After he stormed out my sargent laughed his ass off and then told me to get my foot off his desk. I of course replied, "Sorry I can't", bastid slapped my foot.   

[*FFC*]

After he stormed out my sargent laughed his ass off and then told me to get my foot off his desk. I of course replied, "Sorry I can't", bastid slapped my foot.   

I would have too  

[V-Man]

Ok man, if you really want in the military.. Don't go down to the local recruiter in the well off Nabourhoods.. They have a group of Well-schooled kids with high grades, and pick and chose..  Go to a recruter in a nabourhood with higher crime rates, school drop outs etc.  They don't have a large pool to draw from..  I was talking with a recruiter in L.A. and he told me that the six local high schools graduate 1500 to 2300 each, every year and 80-90% of the kids can't get in because of records or past issues etc.  Some of them are kids with marks in the 80+ range.. Help the guy out he has to fill a quota for bodies.. Hell he said that is I came to his office on monday, he could have me on a bus/plane to camp by friday..ME a foreiner with memory problems, at 30 so years old.  Now understand if you go that route you will be most likely be getting in and I am not resposible for the fun and tears after that..  Ya'd be doing it for "shits & giggles", and wish you a long and happy life.

[mudguts]

  So far, from what I've seen on this thread, most who've served say it's not a bad deal. If you research the MOS's of the different branches, you WILL find something that will help you out in the civilian sector.  My Mommy and Daddy weren't there to help pay for a college education, so I used the military for that little edge I needed to get started in life 

NEVER
AGAIN
VOLUNTEER
YOURSELF

       
 

[83yota]

OK this is my 2 cents. i was in the AF for 4 years and am now in the AFR (reserves) the only reason i got out was to do ROTC but while i was in was awesome. the hardest part about the choice was how much did i love my family. don't get me wrong the other branch's are great but i had a new born and i my opinion she needed her daddy around and in the AF (except special forces) you are mostly on the back lines. i got to spend some time with 2 USMC units and 1 Army unit. they were a bunch of great guys and yes i know what is said about AF members but if your out there doing it you soon realize your all out there doing the same thing. now 1 more plug for the AF i have seen many members go out with Army, Marine, and even one 1 occasion the Navy but i havent seen eny of them go out with us. so as you can see the AF dose get to mave around ALOT and if you want you can still hang back and be a little more safe. (and no i am not a recruiter i just really enjoyed my time in after i decided to go in)

[rockscrambler]

I spent 8 years in the national guard and the guard has full time employees like any other branch of the military. when I signed up they tried to hire me fulltime while I was still in the recruiters office. you might look into that before you enlist in any of the fulltime military and the reserves are the samething they all have fulltime employees.

[kneedownnate]

Seabees man, that's what I was lookin for!

[swampdonkey]

I have been on active duty in the AirForce of going on 13 years, I have been a Kc-10 crewchief and a F-15 crew chief now I work in A/R shop (crash recovery) in Idaho, My advice to you is look at everything very carefully and don't just jump in, I have been to Iraq twice and Afghanistan once in the last 2.5 years those were 4-6 month tours, the Army may give you a two year enlistmentl but guarantee you a 1 year trip to Iraq or Stan  ASAP (although I would go back in a heart beat) But the AF is not going to give you anything less than a 4 year enlistment. If you get the right job there are bonus packages for high demand jobs like air traffic controller, some times up to $50,000-$60,000...anyway the AF runs the firefighter school for most of the other services, it's in San Angelo Texas

[RHG]

Ya like rockscrambler said...the guard and reserve have full time employees. They are trying to get me a postition out at the base right now. Your a civilian during the week and when your weekend comes up then your Sgt. So and so. You can go on TDY's and make extra dough and they pay great. All the benfits you could ever need plus your doing time for the AF and the civilian. You'll collect mil retirement and what ever retirement you put in through the civ. Sounds like a good deal to me. Basicly what we are ALL saying is that no matter what branch you chose...there are sooo many things that you can use to your advantage. Get a job that will help you in the civ world when you get out and use the hell out of your tuition assistance. Work the recruiters for everything you can. Its as good as you make it.