Author Topic: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild  (Read 195147 times)

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Gnarly4X

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #30 on: Jul 06, 2016, 02:34:50 PM »
It must be in the air to rebuild 22re's. I just dropped mine in last Sunday and am waiting for the injectors to come back.  Good to know about that issue with Engnbldr's timing set thoug!

Hi M,

Are you doing complete rebuild.  Engine out of truck?  Who did you send your injectors to?  Are you doing any "extras" while rebuilding it?



1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #31 on: Jul 06, 2016, 02:39:36 PM »
....  Good to know about that issue with Engnbldr's timing set thoug!

Well... like Tod said, it may just be my unusual engine block and TC cover issue.  :dunno: 

But, I'd like to hear about anyone else that has installed engbldr's T-C kit lately.  :headscratch:

Gnarls.
« Last Edit: Jul 06, 2016, 02:47:26 PM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #32 on: Jul 06, 2016, 03:57:52 PM »
My last engine snapped a rod and blew out the block. The only extras I did was put in a 261 cam from Engnbldr with his stock replacement head. The injector deal ended up being a huge mess and either USPS, the company they drop them off to or Witchhunter(which I doubt) lost mine so I ended up ordering some from LCE. If you aren't in a hurry I'd get them cleaned as I heard it makes quite a difference. I'm very interested in seeing your thoughts on the 261C with a header, I still have the stock manifold. The one thing I did for sure do was new engineotor mounts. I used GM transmission mounts which are Polly.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #33 on: Jul 06, 2016, 06:22:46 PM »
My last engine snapped a rod and blew out the block. The only extras I did was put in a 261 cam from Engnbldr with his stock replacement head. The injector deal ended up being a huge mess and either USPS, the company they drop them off to or Witchhunter(which I doubt) lost mine so I ended up ordering some from LCE. If you aren't in a hurry I'd get them cleaned as I heard it makes quite a difference. I'm very interested in seeing your thoughts on the 261C with a header, I still have the stock manifold. The one thing I did for sure do was new engineotor mounts. I used GM transmission mounts which are Polly.

Wow... rod snapped... isn't that rare for a 22?

261C, what made you chose that one?  I'd really like to hear how you like the 261.  Will you be able to compare it to your last engine?

Sorry to hear someone lost your injectors!  I have already sent mine to WitchHunter and have them sitting on my desk.

The stock header is a good stock header, but a DT header will be VERY noticeable, especially from 2500 to 3500 RPM.  The 22RE is a little sensitive to backpressure - it likes to feel some backpressure.  If you go too big on the exhaust system you will feel a noticeable drop in torque.

That's just my worthless opinion.

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #34 on: Jul 06, 2016, 06:28:17 PM »
What do you guys like to use as gasket sealant on the intake manifold gasket, if any?  I'm leaning towards Ultra Black?

Thanks,

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #35 on: Jul 06, 2016, 06:31:54 PM »
... I had an issue with the rocker assemble ...

My I ask what kind of issue?

Thanks,

Gnarls.


1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #36 on: Jul 06, 2016, 06:47:49 PM »
My I ask what kind of issue?

Thanks,

Gnarls.




The rocker assemble was rebuilt with new shafts and reconditioned rocker arms and then used in a previous build for a short time (long story). Anyway, I had intended to re use the rocker assembly, but I found that the shafts had some how gotten chewed up. So now I have new shafts and rockers on the way.
80 shortbed-22re,w56,Marlin 23 spline dual cases,HighAngle drivelines,RUF/63"chevy's,35''mtr's,85 front axle,30 spline Longfields, Allpro highsteer.87 rear axle,5.29 gears,rear spool,BudBuilt cm, marlin HD clutch,ramsey 8000 winch. 
     Also 84 toy DD 22R 4.88s,33'' toyo mt'z, marlin clutch,4inch lift/63's, HA drivelines.

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #37 on: Jul 06, 2016, 06:52:23 PM »
Yes it is, I have had a rod and a crankshaft break in the two trucks I've had, both were rolled though. I choose the 261C as I was leaning toward the 270 but E-mailed Engnbldr and he suggested I go with the 261 based on their being no intake mods and for exhaust I'll be running 2" to the muffler then 2.25 to the tail pipe.

What do you guys like to use as gasket sealant on the intake manifold gasket, if any?  I'm leaning towards Ultra Black?

Thanks,

Gnarls.

As for intake gaskets I've always bought Fel-pro ones. They've got sealant around the edges of the intake manifold to head section and I've never had a leak with them.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #38 on: Jul 06, 2016, 07:15:41 PM »
... Engnbldr and he suggested I go with the 261 based on their being no intake mods and for exhaust I'll be running 2" to the muffler then 2.25 to the tail pipe.

Well I hope we have made the choice with the 261.  Yes, the 270 will trade off too much low end torque for high RPM power.  I need more torque.  I  will check out the Fel Pro gaskets.   Thanks.

Gnarls.

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #39 on: Jul 06, 2016, 07:27:11 PM »
Also, look at picking up some M10x1.25 48mm studs and use those for the starter unless you still have the stock top stud for it. Makes life so so much easier. I will be comparing this one to my stock cam, which I could 75-80 in 4th with it.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #40 on: Jul 07, 2016, 07:18:46 AM »
 :spin:
Also, look at picking up some M10x1.25 48mm studs and use those for the starter unless you still have the stock top stud for it. Makes life so so much easier. I will be comparing this one to my stock cam, which I could 75-80 in 4th with it.

Yes, I think I'd rather get cane'd than installl the starter... it's a bear!!

Gnarls in the garage hot and sweaty  :spin:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #41 on: Jul 07, 2016, 09:18:01 AM »
Self education is a time consuming thing… 

I should have looked at all of the components and parts to check out their condition BEFORE. 

Now I have to stop again and take 1.5 hours to get to the Toy dealer and buy parts.  :willynilly:

…. I’m sure it’s because I’m deficient in more than 100 brain cells.  :yikes:

Here are the two water ports that are too rusty and better to replace them now.  :disturbed:


Gnarls  :spin:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #42 on: Jul 07, 2016, 12:00:25 PM »
What do you guys like to use as gasket sealant on the intake manifold gasket, if any?  I'm leaning towards Ultra Black?

Thanks,

Gnarls.

For the intake gasket, I used permatex copper. It's great for higher heat seals like the intake, and works perfectly!

Make sure you're using Toyota red coolant. I buy 1 gallon, dump it in, and fill the rest with distilled water.
1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #43 on: Jul 07, 2016, 12:50:40 PM »
For the intake gasket, I used permatex copper. It's great for higher heat seals like the intake, and works perfectly!

Make sure you're using Toyota red coolant. I buy 1 gallon, dump it in, and fill the rest with distilled water.


Hey e,

OK, I didn't think about P-copper, I have P-Form-a-gasket #2, P-High Tack, P-Ultra Black.

On the coolant.... like many motorheads I've done lots research on this often debated subject.  I have always used just green EG (ethylene Glycol) mixed with distilled water to 50/50.

Some experts have stated that DexCool has a high pH (alkaline) and can cause corrosion of aluminum surfaces.  The key thing is to make sure you check the pH of whatever coolant you use.  If the pH is too low - too acid, it can be corrosive to metal surfaces.  If the pH is too high - alkaline, it can be corrosive to aluminum alloy.  Over time, the pH typically goes lower, more acidic.

I <should> change my coolant when the pH goes above 10 or lower than 8, or about every 2 years.  You can buy very inexpensive coolant testers.

If you use DexCool or Toyota pink coolant, you should check the pH frequently to make sure it doesn't get too acidic.

I buy WalMart brand coolant...

That's just my worthless opinion.

Gnarls.
« Last Edit: Jul 07, 2016, 03:46:48 PM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #44 on: Jul 07, 2016, 01:25:16 PM »
Same boat at Gnarly with the coolant. I have Walmart sitting in my garage with some distilled water. 22re performance says to use a coolant without any phosphates.

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #45 on: Jul 07, 2016, 01:34:07 PM »
Gotcha.. also, a good note here, the Toyota pink is a premix and is for vehicles 2005 and newer. The red (super long life) is for the older generations

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1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #46 on: Jul 07, 2016, 01:37:12 PM »


22re performance says to use a coolant without any phosphates.

Also, make sure there aren't any silicates.
And if you have the original copper  radiator, the organic-acid-technology corrosion inhibitors aren't effective for those metals or the soldering used in those radiators.

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1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #47 on: Jul 07, 2016, 04:04:08 PM »
:spin:
Yes, I think I'd rather get cane'd than installl the starter... it's a bear!!

Gnarls in the garage hot and sweaty  :spin:

I am curious about this as we changed the starter on my 22RE on the road to Moab and it was about a 15 minute project in the Autozone parking lot. What makes yours so difficult?
1989 4Runner: Dual Ultimate (Inchworm front & Marlin 4.70 rear), Marlin Twin Stick, 1200-lb clutch, 4.88 R&P, Aussie Front, Detroit rear, 30-spline Longs, Long hub gears, ARP hub and knuckle studs & 35x12.50 Cooper STT PRO tires.  Marlin rear bumper & sliders.  FROR front bumper.  SAS with Alcan springs & Rancho 9000XL shocks.  Budbuilt Bolt-on traction bar.  Custom Interior Cage by Those Guys Rod and Customs.

Moab Tested & Rubicon Approved

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #48 on: Jul 07, 2016, 04:52:27 PM »
I am curious about this as we changed the starter on my 22RE on the road to Moab and it was about a 15 minute project in the Autozone parking lot. What makes yours so difficult?

Hi b,

Well.. I've always used extra long extensions to get to the top stud and nut and bottom bolt.  I do it from the front passenger side. I haven't had much practice at removing or installing them, so I may be doing it wrong. 

On my 85 straight axle it seemed like I had more room.  On my current '86 there is a little panel on the fender well that I can remove - never done that - but in my most recent disassembly I could not get to that panel.  This time the stud came out of the bell housing so, I will install it back into the bell housing with some blue Loctite before I drop the engine down onto the motor mounts.  I left the leads connected to the start and laying on the frame.  Since I have never pulled a 22 from a vehicle, I'm wasn't sure the best method for R&R'ing it.

It seems in the past to R&R a starter was always one of those deals that makes me swear at it..... that's probably not a good idea!

I've read posts by guys on other Toy forums that claim to rebuild a 22 in 6 hours.  I'm not saying it's not possible, but I'd sure love to witness that!  I've have spent well over 6 hours just cleaning parts and removing old gaskets! But as I always say, I'm way slower at this than the average.

How do your R&R a starter in 15 minutes?

Gnarls.


1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #49 on: Jul 07, 2016, 05:01:16 PM »
I can do a starter in 15 minutes as I've pulled mine over 30 times in the last year trying to track down an issue with starting. But I'm also a small guy. 5'5" and have skinny arms and small hands so getting in there is easy. I think what makes it easier is not having A/C or being carbed.When I went from carbed to efi the starter was harder to replace but not to bad. But now with A/C I teach my self new ways to cuss trying to get it out.

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #50 on: Jul 07, 2016, 05:55:22 PM »
Update:  5:55 pm  - July 7, 2016

I called the Toyota dealer, Parts Dept couldn’t find the two water by-pass ports, so I called Jerry at 22RE Performance. The big one is available, the little is not.  I ordered the big one.  I did some internet research and could not find something that I could use.  So I cut off the rusty nipple and decided I will figure a way to insert a piece of copper or brass tubing as a nipple.

Since the very short distance that the tube/nipple can be inserted, it may be tricky to get something to seal.  The other option is to fully insert a tube, then drill the end of the inserted part from the little press fit end.

Any suggestions are welcomed!

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #51 on: Jul 07, 2016, 05:57:26 PM »
Go to a radiator shop and have them silver solder a new one in.. or almost anyone who can silver solder should be able to help you out. Fittings only cost me about $25 to have connected

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1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #52 on: Jul 07, 2016, 06:00:30 PM »
Go to a radiator shop and have them silver solder a new one in.. or almost anyone who can silver solder should be able to help you out. Fittings only cost me about $25 to have connected

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Hi e,

Thanks.  Can I silver solder a piece in myself with my propane torch and some silver solder?

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #53 on: Jul 07, 2016, 06:02:31 PM »
I wouldn't. From what i gathered when i was doing my fuel line fittings, propane doesn't transfer enough heat.
But if propane does work, be careful with the flux.. i don't see why someone couldn't just silver solder in a barbed fitting if they're good at it

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1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #54 on: Jul 07, 2016, 06:06:56 PM »
I wouldn't. From what i gathered when i was doing my fuel line fittings, propane doesn't transfer enough heat.
But if propane does work, be careful with the flux.. i don't see why someone couldn't just silver solder in a barbed fitting if they're good at it

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OK, I'll check out my local radiator shop tomorrow morning.

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #55 on: Jul 07, 2016, 08:37:33 PM »
Quote from: Gnarly4X link=topic=100729.msg1124932#msg1124932 date=1467935547.

How do your R&R a starter in 15 minutes?

[/quote

Here is my buddy changing the starter.  I think he did all of it from this angle.  I guess my lift, tires, shock hoops, etc., add up to make access pretty easy.
1989 4Runner: Dual Ultimate (Inchworm front & Marlin 4.70 rear), Marlin Twin Stick, 1200-lb clutch, 4.88 R&P, Aussie Front, Detroit rear, 30-spline Longs, Long hub gears, ARP hub and knuckle studs & 35x12.50 Cooper STT PRO tires.  Marlin rear bumper & sliders.  FROR front bumper.  SAS with Alcan springs & Rancho 9000XL shocks.  Budbuilt Bolt-on traction bar.  Custom Interior Cage by Those Guys Rod and Customs.

Moab Tested & Rubicon Approved

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #56 on: Jul 07, 2016, 08:57:34 PM »
Update:  5:55 pm  - July 7, 2016

I called the Toyota dealer, Parts Dept couldn’t find the two water by-pass ports, so I called Jerry at 22RE Performance. The big one is available, the little is not.  I ordered the big one.  I did some internet research and could not find something that I could use.  So I cut off the rusty nipple and decided I will figure a way to insert a piece of copper or brass tubing as a nipple.

Since the very short distance that the tube/nipple can be inserted, it may be tricky to get something to seal.  The other option is to fully insert a tube, then drill the end of the inserted part from the little press fit end.

Any suggestions are welcomed!

Gnarls.


Tap the hole for a npt fitting.

Then screw a nipple into it.
Ed
SoCal
86 SR5 XtraCab
22RE  W56B
31x10.50R15

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #57 on: Jul 08, 2016, 04:21:21 AM »
Tap the hole for a npt fitting.

Then screw a nipple into it.

Hi e,

Thank you for the input.

That is exactly how I first looked at an option.  Drill the port, tap it with NP tap, screw in a new nipple. 

I spent some time online and at 3 stores here in CG. trying to locate a threaded nipple that was small enough for the square port. I suppose there's one out there, but - as we used to say in sand dunes - I'm burning daylight as I encounter these delays.

Plan B - drill out the port, insert a brass or copper tube, silver solder it, drill the port from the bottom to make sure the inserted part does not block the water flow.

I'm happy that there parts out there for a 30 year old engine, but we should be aware that some parts are not, and fabricating some replacements are going to be part of keeping these old truck alive.

Gnarls.

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #58 on: Jul 08, 2016, 04:46:24 AM »
:)bestgen4runner [08:41 PM]:   I am a Master mechanic, Started working on cars at 12, (really) I specilize in Toyota, master diagnostic toyota mechanic for 13+ years

I clipped that from the chat window...

Geezz b, I just want to say thank you for being here and all that you are willing to share to help us DIYers!  :smooch:  :thumbs:  :beerchug: :clap:

Gnarls. :spin:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X [OP]

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Re: Gnarly4X's 22RE Rebuild
« Reply #59 on: Jul 08, 2016, 11:04:50 AM »
7-8 pm - Update on small water by-pass port…

I fabricated a repair with a brass nipple cut off from the piece I bought yesterday.  I drilled the hole with a 5/16” bit.  I filed the end of the brass nipple so I could tap it in with a ball peen hammer.  I don’t think it will leak, but I can silver solder it if I have to.  Since it sits on top of the manifold next to the themostat housing I can see if it leak and get to it to fix it.

Gnarls.

1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

 
 
 
 
 

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