Topic: Death Wabababababaabbbbbale

[yoter4x4]

hey guys, i built longer shackles for the front of my 83 toy.. 6" long. ever since i got it together i'm getting some ridiculous deathwobble at about 40mph and up,

i'm using 2 5/8" bolts on each shackle and noticed there is a little play between the bolt and spring bushing, i'm guessing this is causing it but not sure. any ideas? i never had deathwobble before until i built these shackles

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

could i use a regular shock as a stabilizer shock?

[will.the.thrill]

steering stabilizer = band aid

that and they don't work for with big tires. when my rig was DD i never had a steering stabilizer and never had any deathwobbles with 35 inch tires.

the only time i did have death wobble is when the bushings in the frame tube got killed by several months of hardcore wheelin. so check those out.

anyways, lets have a picture of your current set up, i want to see the shackle angle and i want to see the pinion angle, since that will tell what your caster angle is (since its fixed on that axle assuming you didn't modify the housing/knuckles) and that will help everyone here help you ...  

EDIT: i just re-read the whole post...use the right effin' bolts in the bushing numb nuts!!! 

[emsvitil]

A regular shock may not be valved so the rebound and compression damping are the same.

and

A regular shock may get air in the valving when it's mounted horizontally instead of vertically.

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

ill get a pic posted up to help.

what size bolt does the stock toyota bushing take? if anyone knows

[halfxspaid]

Yoter, fix the play in the bolt and the shackle, thats your problem.     

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

i will do that, i didn't plan on using these bolts for good, but before i went and bought hardware for these shackles i wanted to make sure i would get a good angle with them and all.

i'm sure the frame tube bushing could use a replacing, they have never been replaced. thanks for the advice.

[will.the.thrill]

let us know if it fixes your problem! i got $5 saying it does 

[8D3TOY]

Do you have solid rotors?  Mine are warped and pulsate a bit but after adding 3" soft springs I have tire chirping, knee bruising (from the shifter) can't stop death wobble, continues after I release the breaks as well.  Could be a contributing factor.

[superyota]

check your alignment.  6in longer shackes will rotate the axle enough to where the alignment will be off enough to give you death wobble.  i'll put my money on your alignment being off.  should be 1/8in. towed out. stabilizers only help with bump steer on the road, other than that, they are extra weight on the front axle.  check the alignment and see what it is at.

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

i just ordered new shackles from datinfab.com 5.5" long and come with greasable 18mm bolts and bushings, when they get here i'll install them and see if it fixes the problem, if not my next guess is definitly alignment, but i have never actually "set alignment" nor do i know how, do you think a shop would do it knowing the truck has an ifs box and hi steer already? or would they look at it and be like wtf is this half breed offraod enthusiast crap? thanks again for all the help on my shaky shaky yoter problem!

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

another quick question, i eventually need to get new springs on the front. the skyjackers i run now have been hammy downed from many toyota's and are starting to show the abuse of the trail. i noticed marlin 4" springs are "1.5 inches longer" says the description... which means i would have to move my front hangers up for them to fit properly correct?

i kind of just wanna stick with the stock location of the springs for now and run a good out of the box spring that bolts right up. i found a set of trail gear springs for $180 a side that had good reviews. 47" long is what the descrip said, that's stock length correct?

figured i might as well go through the whole front end... it's the most crucial safety spot on a vehicle IMO. thanks all.

[superyota]

measure from front center of tire to tire, then compare that to the center of the rear side of tire to tire on the front tires. hopefully that makes sense.  the front measurement should be 1/8th inch wider than the measurement from the back side of the tire.
a shop will align it.  they shouldn't have any problem.  your camber/caster might be off a bit, but there is no adjustment for it, and they'll tell you they can't adjust it, no big deal though.  hope this helps.
the springs will bolt right up.  they will move you front axle forward an inch or two though, so check the contact between the tie rod and drag link and make sure they don't cross over eachother and come in contact.  if they do, you will have to mount the steering box forward a bit to make up for it(easy).  keep posted

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

what your saying is find dead center of my 35" tire tread, and measure the width from it to the dead center spot on the other tire, and do the same on the back of the front tires? and the measurement i get on the front of the tires should be an 1/8 of an inch wider.

ill keep posted for sure, luckily a guy in town will do an alignment on anything for only $55 so i'm probably gonna drop it off with him when i get the shackles installed.

my axle needs to be moved up about an inch or two to get my damn tire out of the firewall on the trails, but today when i was putting these leafs on, the only thing i had hooked up on my steering was my drag link, i had a hell of a time getting my axle moved forward enough to line the springs up with there perches for some odd reason. I'm going to take some pics tomorrow morning and show you guys my setup. thanks all.

[OOPS]

I have always set mine on a "toe-in" on any beam axle set up. Here are the specs for the stock set up and I only run 4.5 shackles.

[superyota]

i've had mine "toe-in" before and the death wobble went away, but then it tracked all over the road.  i had a buddy that does alignments for living tell me "1/8in. toe in".  the way roads are built, they have a hump(convex) to help the water drain off them when it rains.  with "toe in", your truck will have a tendency to want to move around alot and pick a side of the road.  "toe- out" will make the truck track down the road straight.  everyone i have ever talked to has said 1/8in. toe out.  if the factory specs say other wards, give it a shot.  i know it didn't work for me.

[OOPS]

You really know what is going. I have always used toe-in on everything from Go-Carts, Drag cars and anything else that had a beam (solid axle) axle.

Here is another solution that people swear by. Dave'z no death wobble shackles. I have not tried them but they say they work.

http://www.davezoffroadperformance.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=19

[79coyotefrg]

1/8 inch toe IN

[superyota]

my bad,i guess i'm wrong .  just read a bunch of posts saying 1/8 to 1/4 toe in.    toe in doesn't work for me though. just my  .  

[Slolyfe]

i'm using 2 5/8" bolts on each shackle and noticed there is a little play between the bolt and spring bushing, i'm guessing this is causing it but not sure.

HAS ANYONE READ THIS THREAD!?!?!?!  RUN THE RIGHT SIZED BOLTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dont worry about towing in your tire by an 1/8 in. Run the right size bolts!!!!!

[hilux-1983]

HAS ANYONE READ THIS THREAD!?!?!?!  RUN THE RIGHT SIZED BOLTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dont worry about towing in your tire by an 1/8 in. Run the right size bolts!!!!!

. that was good!!!

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

when i say a little play, i mean a VERY little bit of play, as in i don't have to hammer them through my bushings on the springs like the original shackle shanks, they kind of just slide right through the spring, but i have the shackles tight enough to where this little bit of play is eliminated.

the wobble has gotten alot better, im just waiting for my new shackles to come in, i'll post to let know if it solves the problem. if not i'll have an alighnment done, my truck does kind of "wander" on the bumpy roads out here, not terrible, but it could probably use an alignment after bashing the rocks for a while.

[Monster Yota]

just read a bunch of posts saying 1/8 to 1/4 toe in.    toe in doesn't work for me though. just my  . 

I have always-ed "toe-in" never "toe-out" my vehicles, and I do not have Any death wobble, from my pro-street drag cars to my crawler... (FYI: I do not run a steering stabilizer on my crawler) That being said I always "toe in 1/16" to 1/8" depending on what vehicle it is. I would not recommend "toeing in" a 1/4" it might drive smooth at 1/4" but it will cause excessive tire wear/cupping... 

I would also do a run through of your rig, check the steering box, make sure its tight, check the pitman arm on the sector shaft,(this will cause wobbles if loose) ,, check each of your TRE make sure they are not loose and or worn out,, steering arms, make sure they are torqed down,,, check your caster angle, should be anywhere from 5-7*,, make sure your wheel bearings are not loose or worn out, obviously you dont want any play in your shackles, make sure your lug nuts are tight and your tires are not falling off....  I have seen this happen, wasnt pretty.... Same thing if you run wheel spacers, throw a torq wrench on them as well, better to be safe then have your super swamper come off on the freeway doing 55   

[yoter4x4 [OP]]

thanks monster yota,

i installed my new 5.5 inch shackles, no wobble what so ever, truck drives smooth and solid down the road, i also don't run a stabilizer. i run High steer tht was installed years ago and i'm not sure the front of this truck has EVER seen an alighnment, but i threw a wrench at every bolt on the front end to make sure it was torqued to spec/ tight, everything was good. it suprises me because this truck has been beat to hell not only by me, but the 2 previous owners who seemed to think a lift kit and full throttle was the definition of rock crawlin.... 

  fixed all the unfixed problems the previous owners ignored and spent some cash on it.  it's a crawlin SOB now!

[hilux-1983]

Sweet