Starting a new buggy project for wheelin in N.W.

[brc]

Here is the plan I have a 73 cruiser frame I am almost completed with full width SOA/SR.  I am running a FW D60 front and a 14 bolt rear.  I am running 39.5X15X16.5 TSL's on hummer dual beadlocks recentered to 4.0in B.S.  I plan to build this as light as possible.  I am getting a hood from holeshot it is the fiberglass one with fenders built in raised up to the hood line (weighs about 25-30lbs).  My tub is shot so I am cutting the quarters off and building a skeleton frame and covering it in aluminum.  I will cut to follow original body shape minus moving my inner fenders in the back up 3.5 in I am trying to keep this pretty low.  I am down to the dilemma of drive train.  I originally purchased a LT1/700R4 and ?/case (haven't decide yet between the atlas or orion)to go in it but am trying to cut weight so I was thinking about the 3RZ W/85 5spd and duals. 

Other places I have tried to cut weight is I replaced the windshield frame with a fiber glass unit with a Polycarb wind shield.  I cut out all the old dash and rebuilt the dash board with a full aluminum I have 3 gauges a Tach O/press and fuel gauge.  I am running a Mojave heater unit and plan to run a full soft top.  The only other place I though about weight loss is in the hummer wheels man they are heavy suckers I will have to weigh them.  I like the idea of dual bead locks but I very seldom go below 8 psi.  I haven't lost a bead yet but I don't want to either because it always happens at the worst possible time.  So some one pipe up and give me some opinions on drivetrain please.

THANKS brc

[freds40]

On the drive train, I'd say run an Atlas over the Orion. First off the Atlas would be lighter (Atlas-AL case, Orion-cast case) and also I don't think they have yet cleared up the problem with the Orion of when you make a steep decent, the case popping into neutral.
On the other hand, the all Toy setup would likely be a couple-few hundred pounds lighter. With the weight you're looking @, I think it would still have plenty of power.
For wheels, I'd look into some AL beadlocks if you want to save weight. I've ran Hummers and they are definately not light. If you needed them, I've heard that TR is making some dual beadlocks in AL.
  For more weight saving ideas, check out some of the "Kate" builds by WNGROG on Pirate. Super sick rig with some great ideas built into it.

[LCOwner]

For more weight saving ideas, check out some of the "Kate" builds by WNGROG on Pirate. Super sick rig with some great ideas built into it.

True but Kate had so much one-off stuff it started to turn me off.  I like the 3RZ idea but hows this...  3RZ/SM420/Toybox etc.  That would keep the drive train shorter than if you were running a Toyota trans.  I know they're heavy but not much.  I would think about using a Taco rear end and a Diamond front axle.  With a glass hood and no bells and whistles the rig could be real light for a Cruiser.  If I ever build a buggy out of my old frame, this is the approach I'll take.

[freds40]

Very true on Kate Tim. Nolan saved weight in some areas but kept it heavy in others. If you're up for changing axles, Diamonds or a Taco axle would be a good place. Also, depending on what you're doing for suspension, I'd suggest air shocks over coils or 1/4s if you're linking it. Much lighter. If you have an open budget, you could look  into getting your tube work done out of Chromo. You can use say .095 in place of .120 wall tube and still be as strong if not stronger. Needless to say, theres all kinds of areas to save weight, but light and strong usually means $$$

[brc]

I never thought of the chromo (I will have to check the prices for the tube) good call I just bought a miller syncrowave 200 tig machine that lays down some sweet welds.  That is how I am going to do the aluminum sides.  I am building the skeleton frame out of 1X1X1/8in aluminum angle and then welding the skins to that.  I am putting boat sides on it and they will end up three inches above the original bottom door opening, so I will be redoing the bottom of my soft doors.  I will definately look into the the 420 and toy box.  I have a buddy that is foaming at the mouth for the LT1/700R4 so I might just let them go I really like the 3RZ idea. 

Well I guess I have some choices to make 

[brc]

I am shooting for a 100in wheel base.  I really like the idea of the 60 and 14bolt and a littel weight down low.  I am using the fiberglaas w/frame and poly winshield after my last experience of not having weight down low ie. side hill and tall cruiser equal over and over I go. 

As far as the SM420 goes anyone know how much they weigh?  I have the 85 5spd as a spare for my four runner and I can weigh it this weekend for a comparison.  I was a little worried about the length of the five speed and duals but if I have to I can run a four core radiator and push the engine and tranny/t/case forward a good bit and run a pusher electric fan. 

I just called my buddy at the metal shop WOW chromoly isn't exactly cheap!!!  I will have to ponder this before I sink that much into the cage.  He did say a stick of chromo was way lighter than DOM. 

On a good note I can sell the LT1 and 700R4 for enough to buy the 3RZ and duals.

[LCOwner]

An SM420 weighs about 100lbs.  So I would imagine you would be sacrificing about less than 50lbs but losing maybe 6" of drive train.  Push the engine as far forward as the trans shifter will allow.  More weight over the front wheels is better.  SM420 can be had for as little as $25 but at that price expect it to need service.  Marlin builds a nice 420 but it will cost you.

[brc]

Thanks for the info - I will begin hunting for a SM420 this weekend.  I will have to get a toy box as well.  I figure if I can get it under 4k lbs I will be doing good but I am shooting for 3800 or less. 

Since I have to replace so much on the tub anyway I am considering replacing the floor of the tub with aluminum as well then all that will be steel on the body is the cowl and grill.

I am just about finished making up some hood hinges they look pretty much original but I am making them out of aluminum with bronze bushings for the pins.  Man they are going to be sweet.  It just takes a LLLLLLLOOOOOOONNNNNGGGGGG time to mill them. 

I am going to go Saturday and pick op the 3RZ at a local yard here it is out of a 04 Taco W/19K showing on the odometer.  I am getting everything all the harnesses fuel pump filter and ecu for $1300 out the door.  I am pulling it w/one of there yard guys I said I would buy it but I want to pull it so stuff is taken care of as it comes out.

Friday my buddy is coming to get the LT1/700R4. 

I have to get my butt in gear to have this completed by July 4.  I only get to work on it saturday and sunday afternoons so it will be tight getting it done by then.  Working 12's everyday is for the birds.

[brc]

One question I haven't considered yet how am I going to adapt the SM420 to the 3RZ?  I will have to look around but I haven't seen anything on adapting the two anywhere?  Any idea's

I am going to keep plugging away at the body till I get this figured out.

[brc]

I could not find a adapter to go between the 3RZ and SM420 so - I am going with the W56 and duals.  I am going to best buy tonight to look for a new digi camera so hopefully pictures real soon.

Tomorrow I pick up the 3RZ.

I have to get back to work

[LCOwner]

http://www.ottindustries.com/22re-sm.htm

[brc]

Sweet!  Thanks LCOwner now my head is spinning again.  I will be back to weighing the W56 and duals.  Just to compare either way the 3RZ is going in my friend is coming ovewr to the shop tonight to up LT1 & 700R4.  Thanks again u da man!

[LCOwner]

At 100" wheel base I'm interested to see what your drive line looks like.  I'm at 105-106" and mine is steep, but the V8 is back to about an inch from the fire wall.

[Dooner]

Youll be way better off with the 420 with the compound low first gear at 7.05:1. Marlin rebuilt my 465, built a Toy topshifter t-case and assembled it with my Toybox w 4.7 gears and my 10 spline tranny output shaft for just over a grand. With that kind of reduction, you can get away with a single t-case and stock axle gears at around 135:1. Or toss in the second case at 2.28:1 and your at around 308:1! Or Toss in some 5.29's and your looking at 400:1. At that point your not really moving any more. If you combine the single case with 4.7 gears, the SM420's 7.05 1st gear, and 5.29 axle gears you will have a nice compact setup at over 175:1.
Mike

[brc]

In my cruiser with v-8 and 465 my drive line isn't to steep.  I am right at about 100in right now.  I have my engine set pretty far forward about 2 1/2 in between the fan and the radiator.  I had a drive shaft built with standard mini truck joints and I have no problems (SOA S/R and flipped springs.

I went and pulled the 3RZ today I got all the harnesses,fuel tank w/pump power steering hoses pretty much everything under the hood and then some. 

I am going to measure the length of the W/56 and single case in my four runner to get a starting point then I just installed duals in my buddies truck and measure them.

I started cutting out the sides of my old tub to build the aluminum sides I didn't get to far I was pretty tired after pulling the motor and everything else today. 

My wife is out looking for a new digital camera tonight so I can hopefully take some pictures of everything to show you all.

[brc]

I am finally back from the desert uncle sam saw fit to send me to for 6 months.  I kind of changed my mind about the drivetrain all together.  I am running mini axles w/longfields in the front w/highpinion/5.29s and detroits f/r.  I have a guy from over near seatle coming to pick up the one ton axles next week and I will be ordering the high pinions and longfields. 

I have the 3rz with w/56 and mini case in and mocked up where they will set.  I think the rear drive line will be ok with only a single case and 4.7's.  I will be a hole lot lighter with the mini axles over the one tons.  I am going to step down in tire size to 37's and I plan to go with a aluminum beadlock (not sure which one yet).  My wheel base right now is 100 in I am going to shoot for a pretty much flat belly.  I hope to have this done in the next 2-3 months.  Once all my parts get here I am taking a months leave and getting as much done as possible. 

One question does anyone have a reccomendation for a soft top.  I would like to have a little inclement weather protection if need be.

Man its good to be back in the states.

[Dooner]

Welcome back! 
Post pu some pics of your build when you get a chance

[brc]

WOw have things changed lately.  After another deployment I am back.  I parked the cruiser in the corner of the shop and not touched it for a LONG time.  I started my own buisness and it has been taking up alot of time.  I am only 4yrs from retiring from USAF and figured it was now or never to start my buisness.  I have been really busy but after Oct 23 I will be back on the cruiser for a while anyway.

I went with TOY running gear instead of one tons and I got most of the tube work done.  I need to plumb fuel lines and re-wire the whole thing then I will be on the road.  I bought a CTD to tow with so I am just going to run a bikini top and ditch the soft top idea.  I still need some tires and bead locks.  I did weigh everything and I am at a little over 3K with 35in bfg's monuted to roll it around on.  I will post up some pic's when I uncover it and get it back out of the corner of the shop.

[topar]

Everything sounds good but...
 

[Dooner]

Hey Billy, when you gonna get a camera?

[brc]

I am back in A$$krakistan again I will not be back state side till sometime mid Apr.  The only good thing about being deployed as much as I am I get to save a good bit of money.  I found out before I left though I came back in Apr and leave to come back here again in Sept SWEET

[Dooner]

Sheesh! How many times you been deployed out there? your not one of those Blackwater dudes are you? Tell them that your trying to get your Cruzer together, they'll probably let you come home early. Hey while your out there buy one of them $5.00 Nikon cameras, I hear they work real good.

[brc]

I average at least 2 - 120day + deployments a year.  In 2007 I have been deployed 313 so far not that I am counting or anything.  I would like to buy a camera here but I am restricted to base for the whole deal.  I am not Blackwater those guys make serious $$$$.  I have 15yrs in the Air Force.  It is bad when the TCN's know you by name.  I hope to be back in March but we will see.  I can only get on line here about once a week or so.  I have to get my Marlin fix then:-)

[brc]

here are a few pic's from the cruiser suspension.  I just got back from being deployed AGAIN!!!!

[brc]

more

[brc]

more

[brc]

last one for now i need to take more to get caught up

[jedrattle]

  I am interested to see your build up. I am doing a `69 cruiser with a 3.4 taco V6, R150 trans, and dual cases with a 4.7 gearset. I am running a 64in diamond housing in the front (all mini truck guts) and an e locker taco rear. I am cutting the tub behind the door and tubing it out. I plan to skin the back part. I want it be light weight as possible.  I think with the weight you are after, it should be alright. 

[T.U.F.F.]

I have more pictures for this finally to post on here.  I got the steering finished minusone bolt and thehigh steer complete.  I built a aluminum dash panel and installed it.

I am ready to start on the cage i got my airover hydro tube benderlast week.

I am missing the darn windshield frame brackets so if any one has one I need to get a set soon fora early tub and windshield frame.

Thanks

[T.U.F.F.]

I replaced the stcok geared case with a single 4.7 mini case.  My direction is heade a different direction I wamt to be able to use this for hunting first.  I herniated disc's and will be getting surgery later next year.  Hopefully I can use it with my dis abled hunters card.  I am not looking forward to 4 fused vertebrates.

Pictures on the way.