Does Everyone Need A Solid Axle?

[Skinny_Pedal]

Let's ponder this question. Does everyone really need a solid axle rig? The reason i bring this topic up is we get a lot of people on this board and other boards. They see our rigs and go "yeah i want a solid axle to". But really does everyone need it?  I'm going to say no. A lot of people think they need it but they don't, there ifs will work fine. It seems its a lot of the younger crowd; like 16 just getting there license. There just learning to drive and the first thing they want to do is do an sas....why? learn to wheel your rig first! I wheeled the piss out of my ifs then upgraded. The point I'm trying to make is everybody doesn't need a solid axle. you can build a nice trail truck that is ifs. lockers front and rear and a crawler and you have a nice rig. so my little rant it get to know your rig first. wheel it as is for awhile then decide if you really need a solid axle. just my little rant and 

[MiniSimp]

Here is my list of vehicles:
1988 Toyota IFS (when I was 16)
1995.5 Tacoma IFS
2001 Dodge Dakota IFS
1985 Toyota Solid Stock (now when I'm 29)

I beat the hell out of my IFS truck with no breakage except 1 broken front drive shaft.

[blackdiamond]

Many people don't wheel hard enough to know the difference, why give up the highway ride of the IFS?  Everyone wants the I guess.

[hornett22]

IFS is wheelable but it sucks.you risk a bent frame.it just isn't as strong or forgiving.plus it makes the engine easier to work on.

[kneedownnate]

I've said for quite some time that for what I do I don't really "need" a straight axle.  The majority of my off roading consists of old logging roads, skid trails and the occasional trail, but nothing I couldn't do with an ifs truck.  My first truck was an 84 nissan 720 4by, and it had horrible ground clearance, tall rear end and t-case gears and mushy ifs.  It rode nice in a straight line, but if you were going through a corner and it hit a bump it would bob and weave.  I've driven a couple midish 80s toyotas and they're not nearly as bad, felt much more stable.  I drive my 4by hard on the street, and friends sometimes hafta ask me if I remember we're in my 4by and not my 2wd.  With stock suspension the truck borderline rails through the corners, as many tailgating straighliners have found out on buckhorn.  I just like my straight axle.

But to answer your question, no not everyone needs one, like you said it's often just the supposed bling factor.

[Rocksurfer]

I wheeled the hell out of my 86 Turbo 4Runner, and I mean I took it everywhere. Doran, Empire Strikes Back, Rubicon, Swamp, Los Coyotes, Sledge Hammer,Santiago, etc, etc, never had any troubles I just got used to being on 3 wheels all the time. In all the time I wheeled it I broke 1 front axle, the short stubby one and also broke an upper Downey A-arm. I say even for the tough stuff you can wheel an IFS, you just have to look at the obstacle differently than if you have live axles. My 4Runner had minimal upgrades (as usual for me), it came with an auto-trans so I could crawl out of the box, 4:88.1 in the diffs, lockers front and rear, 2inch body lift and 33" rubber, and the Downey long-travel upper A-Arms. Had lots of fun with that truck.

[6.72:1]

Of course solid-axle is a must. I don't even wheel mine, but I find the live axle a must. Well, I did have an '82 2WD before I conjured up the thing I am driving now. Okay, I guess you can get away (sometimes) with IFS. Then again, I am looking for a 14-bolt rear and a Dana 60 front....

[Rocksurfer]

Man some of my club members would love to be on the side lines watching this we have discussed this issue into the ground. Yes, a solid axle is better, but an IFS can and does go most places the average moderate to hardcore wheeler wants to go. It's when you start getting extreme that the IFS system lags.  I took my IFS everywhere I wanted to go and I took it on some pretty hardcore trails. Granted you may not climb on top of that huge rock to show how flexy your truck is but you didn't need to climb it to drive the trail anyways.

[6.72:1]

True.

[Skinny_Pedal]

Man some of my club members would love to be on the side lines watching this we have discussed this issue into the ground. Yes, a solid axle is better, but an IFS can and does go most places the average moderate to hardcore wheeler wants to go. It's when you start getting extreme that the IFS system lags.  I took my IFS everywhere I wanted to go and I took it on some pretty hardcore trails. Granted you may not climb on top of that huge rock to show how flexy your truck is but you didn't need to climb it to drive the trail anyways.

thanks you thank you thank you. that was the perfect response. the point im trying to make to the youngins that come on this board is you do not need to go solid right away. learn to drive your ifs. then when you actually get to the hard core point like the hammers( i have still seen ifs on the hammers) then go solid.

[mr4x42u]

Right,,its a matter of how extreme one gets off road..IFS has a time and place..My ifs taco is a dream to drive in the chappy sand..just the fact that it has a better ride and less bounce makes it faster then a solid axle...depends on the person..on the same note an ifs is going to hate life in the rocks..

[Skinny_Pedal]

many people seem to put a solid axle inder there rig and they dont play on the rocks

[To The Floor]

i wheeled the piss out of my 2wd ifs 92 toyota pickup. whenever i went with my friends who had 4 bys i made it most of the places they did.  except for i didnt try some of the mud holes that they tried, but i bet i made it 85% of the places they did.  that truck did some serious wheelin for a 2wd, so anyone who wants to just mud or mild to wild trails, stick with ifs,  solid axles should be for a truck that sees quite a bit of rocks.

[To The Floor]

and btw hornet22, chit can that avatar..  please just get it the flop off of this website

[Rocksurfer]

Right,,its a matter of how extreme one gets off road..IFS has a time and place..My ifs taco is a dream to drive in the chappy sand..just the fact that it has a better ride and less bounce makes it faster then a solid axle...depends on the person..on the same note an ifs is going to hate life in the rocks..

I loved the rocks and twistys in my IFS, sure I was lifting a tire here and there sometimes sky-high but the truck sat level. I do have to say that from what I've seen and experienced that the IFS/autotrans combo works better than the stick combo, I could work my way through while sticks even with crawler gears struggled more. If the current truck I bought would not have been available when I was in the market I was looking at getting a IFS V6 automatic 4Runner. Lift it a little lock up those axles and you are ready to go. Like I said my club members beat this to death since I don't mind an IFS Toyota, we came to the conclusion that yes a solid axle is better but take the right lines with an IFS (that means you can't just follow that guy in front of you with solid live axles) you can go to the same places together. About the only thing I'd suggest if you build an IFS for hardcore is to make sures to brace the rear mounts of the lower IFS A-Arms under the frame to keep the frame from twisting, that would be the only issue in the since of bending your frame. I never had any issues with bending the frame from lifting a tire with that rear crossmember installed.

[Rocksurfer]

Here are the several links on my clubs BB on the IFS issue, some of it is pretty funny

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=113

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=194

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=302

[hornett22]

to the floor,why get rid of it? if it upsets you it's worth keeping .and buy the way  GFYS

[To The Floor]

why on god green earth would you even have it?  i could understand if it was humorours, but it's not. it's just disgusting.  btw nice pm you sent me, hopefully you will grow up someday, but i am glad that you are a little more mature to send that to me in a pm rather than posting it on the board to try to put me down in public, and it was a total joke in the first place, you can have whatever the hell avatar you want, i just wrote that to be humorous, just as i am sure you have that avatar to be humorous.  im sorry you didnt catch on to my humor and im not trying to start a pissing match.  have a great day hornet

[TurtleTruck]

Here are the several links on my clubs BB on the IFS issue, some of it is pretty funny

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=113

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=194

http://www.spinninfours.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=302

Wow...  I just went through those threads again...     some good debate, especially in the first one!


I agree with the original premise of this thread...  yes, not everyone needs a SA... 

I was very impressed with the trails that an IFS Toyota and an IFS Ranger could do on our last trip to Moab...

Poison Spider Mesa, Steelbender, Elephant Hill, Cliffhanger (but it has been improved to provide access to repair the gas pipeline that crosses Amasa Back, so it is no longer hardcore)...

To summarize the above links:

Is a SA better than an IFS for hardcore wheeling, especially in rocks?  Without a doubt YES!

Can you go a lot of places in an IFS rig and have a great time?  Without a doubt YES!

  to all!

[Rocksurfer]

Wow...  I just went through those threads again...     some good debate, especially in the first one!


I agree with the original premise of this thread...  yes, not everyone needs a SA... 

I was very impressed with the trails that an IFS Toyota and an IFS Ranger could do on our last trip to Moab...

Poison Spider Mesa, Steelbender, Elephant Hill, Cliffhanger (but it has been improved to provide access to repair the gas pipeline that crosses Amasa Back, so it is no longer hardcore)...

To summarize the above links:

Is a SA better than an IFS for hardcore wheeling, especially in rocks?  Without a doubt YES!

Can you go a lot of places in an IFS rig and have a great time?  Without a doubt YES!

  to all!

I was wondering how long it would take you to get here with your SA sabre. I forgot about Fred & Wilson. Though Fred was pretty embarrassed with that hi-center at the end. 

[seanc]

i am suprised no one has put this. i know the SA cost money to swap in when done right, but lifts are cheap for SA compared to IFS...

[6.72:1]

many people seem to put a solid axle inder there rig and they dont play on the rocks

I have a solid axle and I have never seen a rock.

[Skinny_Pedal]

I have a solid axle and I have never seen a rock.

it also came with it stock and you have a suspension not capable of going rock crawling

[Rocksurfer]

it also came with it stock and you have a suspension not capable of going rock crawling

Aww, come on, he can rock crawl it. It will just feel like an IFS with no travel.

[guywithuglyyota]

Myself and a co-worker had this debate. He was really wanting to SAS but then he actually stopped and thought about the kind of wheeling he is into. And we agreed a SAS is not necessary for his type of wheelin. Hes gonna go with a chaos fab kit, upgrade the anemic idler arm assembly and keep wheelin.
I chose to SAS because I wanted the simple solid axle, and I am too lazy to aquaint myself with the IFS world only to torch it off after realizing a solid axle fits MY needs better.

So I say to each his own. Ifs can kick some a$$, solid axle can kick some A$$ with some added peace of mind with aftermarket axles   

[toynorcal]

Insert Quote
Quote from: BIGTONKA on Yesterday at 08:35:56 PM
I have a solid axle and I have never seen a rock.



it also came with it stock and you have a suspension not capable of going rock crawling 

   

[6.72:1]

You don't blame me, do you? There are no rocks out here in Alabama. Just redneck mud bogs. I don't even get in those because the clean-up is entirely too entailing. Besides, I am only a set of Marlin springs, smaller tires, another transfer case, lockers, sliders, four-link suspension, and beadlocks away from a crawler.  lol

[Shamb]

good point Skinny, I didnt read all the response but this is true, my first rig was a 88' Toyota pickup.. completely stock except 31" Wildcats and Rancho 5000's. I took this rig to Fordyce and back a couple times.. it had been EVERYWERE.. absolutely loved it.. besides that it was a challenge and I dont care what anyone says, IFS can take a BEATING!!


It's just a fade.. .it'll go away like everything else eventually.

PErsonally if it was my DD.. I wouldn't go SAS.. stay IFS and build it up a bit...  i woudln't run a sas'd vehicle as many miles to work as I do everyday, just beat the crap out of you

[hornett22]

why on god green earth would you even have it? i could understand if it was humorours, but it's not. it's just disgusting. btw nice pm you sent me, hopefully you will grow up someday, but i am glad that you are a little more mature to send that to me in a pm rather than posting it on the board to try to put me down in public, and it was a total joke in the first place, you can have whatever the hell avatar you want, i just wrote that to be humorous, just as i am sure you have that avatar to be humorous. im sorry you didnt catch on to my humor and im not trying to start a pissing match. have a great day hornet

then i appologize publiclly.i guess i spent to much time on pirate 4x4.seemed like one of the bitter responses there.i must be slipping in my "old age" LOL. again,sorry for that. glad we can be civil here.i shouldn't have assumed that at you age you were a punk.i find your avatar humorous as well,LOL

[hornett22]

and to the rest of you,i drive my SASed 4runner on 900+ mile trips several times a year and it is my daily driver and trail rig.it does fine. look Ma,no sway bar! i think you could do a SAS cheaper than a quality IFS lift.if you are going to run IFS,please brace the back of the lower A arms.i had to have my frame straightened.