Topic: Tips for offroading with a manual/stick shift trans

[tactical328]

Looking for tips on wheelin with a stick shift. I've had my yot for about a year now and had never previously offroaded a stick shift rig, so I humbly ask the forum what sort of tips do you have for rowing gears on the trail?

I'm not a fan of doing big climbs with my yota since it tends to start hopping on its leafs looking for traction and when I run out of beans on a big hill its usually a pucker factor10 getting the brakes on and restarting or backing down.
Obstacles are fine and crawling over things with traction is the best part of the yota, but just looking for the sage wisdom of those who have wheeled before me.

Cheers

[RUGER]

tactical328

the hopping you said is called axle wrap.
what kind of terrain do you wheel on ie sand, mud, rocks, dirt roads. tell us a little more about yer rig ie lockers, gearing, t-case, lift, tires

RUGER

[OVRAROK]

Keeping control of the gas pedal is the key, it's very easy to start giving it more skinny pedal, that when you'll start noticing the axle wrap. I try and keep my foot 500rpms more then idle. I also wheel my rig, open/open. This way when you get to a stuck place, you have options. Rear/front lockers. Usually with steady pedal control. And a few left to rights on the steering wheel, your out of a tight spot.

[tactical328 [OP]]

Yep i get the axle wrap for sure, I may make a bar at some point but just looking for tips in general about picking gears, when to do what situationally, things not to do that may result in mayhem. I've heard people say never touch your clutch once you start climbing or going downhill, which I understand to an extent but stuff like that.

[Snowtoy]

If you have an efi engine, turning the idle up will help reduce stalling when trying to crawl over obstacles just off idle.

If you have A/C, turning it on will put drag on your engine, allowing to go slower for descending a hill, or when dropping off of ledges, though not as useful when tires are larger than gearing.

As far as what gears to run in, IME, 2nd and 3rd low range are the most useful on the trail in the rocks, you can usually take off in 2nd(assuming you are running tires with correct gear size) and rarely need more speed through smooth terrain than 3rd, as well as 3rd usually having enough torque to slow you down quickly for any surprise change in terrain or opposing traffic, etc, then using 1st low for crawling over obstacles.  Once you have few hundred hours of seat time on different terrain with your rig's set up and driving style, you will have a better idea of what gearing works best.

For descents you should avoid trying to change gears, the momentary depression of the clutch can easily result in a gain of unsafe speed,

A bar wont really help with axle wrap for hill climbs and likely result in breaking something.  The best way to address the issue of axle wrap for your purpose is through lockers and dual transfer cases, so you can climb the hill at a slower speed maintaining traction, and not have to rely on speed alone to get to climb a hill.

[Gnarly4X]

One topic I rarely see being discussed is braking issues, especially when rock crawling or wheeling on terrain where the vehicle is climbing a steep incline, like at the Cinders.

I learned very early on both my 1986 Longbed, automatic, and later on my 1985 Standard Cab, 5-speed.

While climbing a steep rock obstacle, the weight on the front tires practically goes to 10s of pounds instead of 100s of pounds.  The front tires have almost no traction.  Gravity is pulling on the vehicle.

If forward motion is stopped or the vehicle runs out traction, or you want to back off the obstacle, NOW… the rear brakes are taking almost all of the braking force.

So, what happens when the rear brakes cannot put enough pressure to stop the rear wheel from rotating?

I’ve experienced and I’ve seen too many times...the vehicle begins to roll backwards and always out of control.

I used a piece of aluminum flat bar to raise the proportioning valve swing arm lever as though I had 1,000 pounds in bed.

This caused significantly more hydraulic pressure at the rear stock drum brakes. I also installed semi-metallic shoes to get a little more braking friction.

This modification made a very significant difference when rock crawling when having to rely on almost entirely on my rear brakes.

Here’s the trade-off… my pickup was also my daily driver.  When braking on the street, if I hit the brakes a tad too hard, the rear wheels would lock up.  With 33” tires at 25 PSI, this made a very loud and low-pitched screeching sound of tires skidding, and the back end would want to come around.

Fortunately, I got used to it very quicky, like driving in the streets with lockers.

I am pretty sure there were a few times when the rear tires locked up as I was coming to a stop and the vehicle in front of me could hear the tires screeching, I’ll bet the driver pooped his pants!

I’m sure there are other valving options, I just did not have to go that route.

Gnarls.

[Rocksurfer]

Total agreement with Gnarls here, the valving on the rear is critical in avoiding an out-of-control downhill backwards front wheel slide can get scary. I learned the hard way when climbing a steep incline and ran out of steam in my auto 4Runner shifted into reverse was all that was needed to start sliding on the front and very little rear braking. The auto trans is has an electronic torque converter which if you know how to wire it you can shut off the stall which helps a lot. As to a stick, nothing beats gear reduction, Dual Marlin Ultimate's with 4:88's and 33's keep me putting along. Anyone that asks me about the setup my first reply is that my truck will not stop until it flops, with or with my guidance.

[tactical328 [OP]]

One topic I rarely see being discussed is braking issues, especially when rock crawling or wheeling on terrain where the vehicle is climbing a steep incline, like at the Cinders.

I learned very early on both my 1986 Longbed, automatic, and later on my 1985 Standard Cab, 5-speed.

While climbing a steep rock obstacle, the weight on the front tires practically goes to 10s of pounds instead of 100s of pounds.  The front tires have almost no traction.  Gravity is pulling on the vehicle.

If forward motion is stopped or the vehicle runs out traction, or you want to back off the obstacle, NOW… the rear brakes are taking almost all of the braking force.

So, what happens when the rear brakes cannot put enough pressure to stop the rear wheel from rotating?

I’ve experienced and I’ve seen to many times.  The vehicle begins to roll backwards and always out of control.

I used a piece of aluminum flat bar to raise the proportioning valve swing arm lever as though I had 1,000 pounds in bed.

This caused significantly more hydraulic pressure at the rear stock drum brakes. I also installed semi-metallic shoes to get a little more braking friction.

This modification made a very significant difference when rock crawling when having to rely on almost entirely on my rear brakes.

Here’s the trade-off… my pickup was also my daily driver.  When braking on the street, if I hit the brakes a tad too hard, the rear wheels would lock up.  With 33” tires at 25 PSI, this made a very loud and low-pitched screeching sound of tires skidding, and the back end would want to come around.

Fortunately, I got used to it very quicky, like driving in the streets with lockers.

I am pretty sure there were a few times when the rear tires locked up as I was coming to a stop and the vehicle in front of me could hear the tires screeching, I’ll bet the driver pooped his pants!

I’m sure there are other valving options, I just did not have to go that route.

Gnarls.

Thats a very good point! I made a hydraulic handbrake when I converted to rear disks and have a prop valve bolted to it, I should remember to adjust it before hitting the trails to maximize my rear brake power.