Author Topic: high pinion q & carnge pics (updated 1/31) (Read 4700 times)

YotaYota · « **on:** Jan 17, 2005, 10:40:32 AM »

what parts are interchangable between the high pinion and v6 3rds, broke my 5.71's front pinion, so looking into other options, any input appriciated,

thanxs
anthony

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #1 on:** Jan 17, 2005, 02:05:35 PM »

The carrier and all the bearings are interchangable as far as I know. I put a rear v6 carrier and lockrite in my highpinion housing with no problems.

YotaYota · « **Reply #2 on:** Jan 17, 2005, 05:22:53 PM »

thats exactallly the info i was lookin for, thanxs

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #3 on:** Jan 17, 2005, 05:26:45 PM »

I fyou still have the stock carrier n the hp housing it will likely be a 2 spider carrier, it looks just like a normal 4 cyl one. The rear v6 looks a LOT different but its a bolt in deal.

4runner · « **Reply #4 on:** Jan 18, 2005, 07:19:02 AM »

Is this the setup we should use in the rear for strenth and high pinion clearence? Could you use v-6 e-locker in this for rear? Thanks for the info

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #5 on:** Jan 18, 2005, 01:16:09 PM »

Never use a high pinion in the rear it will not live long.

awhotrods · « **Reply #6 on:** Jan 18, 2005, 01:22:35 PM »

I had another HP/V6 third question, So you CAN interchange a V6 carrier with a HP carrier? I have a V6 rear third that came with a factory limited slip, to make a long story short, I put a detroit locker in the V6 and want to put the V6 limited slip in my front HP third member.

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #7 on:** Jan 18, 2005, 01:28:16 PM »

Yes I put a rear v6 carrier and lockrite in my hp front directly.

awhotrods · « **Reply #8 on:** Jan 18, 2005, 02:05:30 PM »

Quote from: WHITE_TRASH on Jan 18, 2005, 01:28:16 PM

Yes I put a rear v6 carrier and lockrite in my hp front directly.

Thanks WT

4runner · « **Reply #9 on:** Jan 19, 2005, 09:56:38 AM »

I understand now. That sounds good for the front. So is there no way to put a HP housing in the rear and hold up? Learn something every day on here Thanks

jr9162 · « **Reply #10 on:** Jan 19, 2005, 01:56:47 PM »

Quote from: 4runner on Jan 19, 2005, 09:56:38 AM

I understand now. That sounds good for the front. So is there no way to put a HP housing in the rear and hold up? Learn something every day on here Thanks

two problems with installing a high pinion in the rear:

1) adequate lubrication
2) you're applying torque on the weaker coast side of the gearset versus the stronger drive side.

Bottom line is hi-pinions should only be used on the front axle. The reason manufacturers get away with using the cheaper standard low pinion rear diff up front is the input shaft (pinion gear) is low enough to be properly lubricated and most people engage 4x4 (on a part time vehicle) less than 10% of the time. And when they do, the torque is split between front and rear.

Driving full time on a high pinion rear diff is asking for trouble. I don't think you'll see many full time 4x4 vehicles without a h pinion front diff.

JR

stomper · « **Reply #11 on:** Jan 19, 2005, 03:11:07 PM »

Just throwing this out there and seeing what ya'll think. IF the oiling issue could be dealt with why couldnt a v6 third be turned upside down in the axle. It would still be running on the strong side if the gears. I dont see where anything would change but the oiling issue.

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #12 on:** Jan 19, 2005, 03:16:46 PM »

If you turn the 3rd over it goes in reverse rotation which would make you go backwards... If you look at rear engined rock buggies they commonly use a ford 9" and install it upside down.

stomper · « **Reply #13 on:** Jan 19, 2005, 05:40:34 PM »

Yea I didn think about that.

YotaYota · « **Reply #14 on:** Jan 21, 2005, 08:37:29 PM »

i got to thinking the other day, ive been in simillar situations (when i snaped the pinion) and only blew a birf,(have one poofeild and othe is stock) why didnt i blow the brif ?? so i tore the frontend down this week, and when i was taking the driveshaft side apart, and split the compainion flange from the slip, put the boken pinion in the vice, i noticed the pinion nut wasnt punch, put the 30mm socket on and the nut was loose !!!!! so what i think happend is when the guy set up my gears (didnt know how to do it at the time) he forgot to punch the nut, and over the course of 9 mon. it loosend up, and last sat. it was loose enough to wedge the pinion, lock up the diff and BOOM, broken pinoin, i told my theory to a few other wheelers, and they agreed w/ me.... any thoughts......i did pay this guy......make him buy new gears and stuff or suck it up and jus buy em myself

jr9162 · « **Reply #15 on:** Jan 21, 2005, 09:58:01 PM »

Well, if you have proof the pinion nut wasn't punched before u took it off the diff, there's no way he shouldn't accept liability. He should be warranting his labor. Problem is, can you prove to him and any other 3rd party that the nut in question was indeed on the broken diff, and it wasn't punched?

YotaYota · « **Reply #16 on:** Jan 31, 2005, 08:21:08 PM »

ok so here they are, carnage pics........

YotaYota · « **Reply #17 on:** Jan 31, 2005, 08:26:24 PM »

2 more

Mike D · « **Reply #18 on:** Jan 31, 2005, 08:46:44 PM »

Weld it

KYOTA · « **Reply #19 on:** Jan 31, 2005, 10:22:58 PM »

I'd be having a talk with your gearman if I were you, take the broken pinion and non staked nut with you. Since you took it apart its going to be harder to prove he didnt stake it, he could say you just got a new nut but hey its worth a shot. Have you pulled the third yet? what does the carrier look like? do you see any contact from the pinion grinding into it?

jr9162 · « **Reply #20 on:** Jan 31, 2005, 11:47:44 PM »

Dang, just twisted that sucka right into didn't it? That's torque for ya. Pay close attention to the pinion gear bearing races in the housing too. They may have spun and I'd be concerned a replacement race won't do the same in the future. Some can be repaired ok, tho.

It's pretty obvious if the nut was used or not. And it certainly is not staked. Problem is, will the shop manager accept your say so that it's the nut off that pinion? A metalurgist could prove it was installed on the pinion, but is it worth going to that expense?

Do not clean the nut. There's metal particles transferred from it and the pinion to each other, just from the friction/galling of the threads. It's supposed to be a self-locking nut - capish?

Good luck!

YotaYota · « **Reply #21 on:** Feb 11, 2005, 10:53:16 PM »

okay now i have a real problem, getting the axel shafts to turn and line up so i can pull them out of the housing, went to do it tonight, got the sob apart but cant spin the axles (for obveious reasons), im really stumped and from what i understand (correct me if im wrong) but the axles have to be lined up if you pull the knuckle way as well. HELP !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hyena · « **Reply #22 on:** Feb 11, 2005, 11:17:56 PM »

Beat it with a BFH. Did you take all the bolts off holding the third member in? It might help, it might not.

WHITE_TRASH · « **Reply #23 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 01:39:25 AM »

Yes the birfs are machined flat on opposing sides. They need the flats to point directly at the trunion bearings.

YotaYota · « **Reply #24 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 12:12:29 PM »

Quote from: WHITE_TRASH on Feb 12, 2005, 01:39:25 AM

Yes the birfs are machined flat on opposing sides. They need the flats to point directly at the trunion bearings.

so what ur sayin is that im pretty much screwed, the only way i can think of to get the axels out is to cut the housing

, the gears are warrenteed, that why im tryin too get em' out, well i guess this is an excuse to build a kick a$$ fornt yoter axel.

Hyena · « **Reply #25 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 12:46:13 PM »

You could also try taking the nuckles off if you haven't already. That will make it easier to move the birfs arounf and try to force them to spin the axles. It might work also.

YotaYota · « **Reply #26 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 05:20:01 PM »

Quote from: Hyena on Feb 12, 2005, 12:46:13 PM

You could also try taking the nuckles off if you haven't already. That will make it easier to move the birfs arounf and try to force them to spin the axles. It might work also.

Tryd that today.........the the ring gear is locked right up, there anint no movin it or the axles, so i think im jus gonna have to cut the housing........and build a new axle, it sucks, but from what i can see i dont have any other choice.

Hyena · « **Reply #27 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 08:19:03 PM »

Is there any way to take off the birfields without taking the axles out too? Is there enough room in the bell area for the birf to slide?

Thumper · « **Reply #28 on:** Feb 12, 2005, 10:51:17 PM »

try this i think that the pinion gear is into the ring gear and wont let it turn take a long drill bit drill into the piniongear where you can see the broke part right well drill down enough where you can insert a bolt and eather slide a welding rod down and weld the bolt too the top of the gear or thread it in or jb weld it in the hole then pull on the gear and try too slide it back twards where it should be and see if that frees it. if not put a big ass pipe wrench on the bif and turn it till it eather breaks the ring gear or the bif , that or cut the front of the diff cover off and get the ring gear unstuck and then weld it back on beefer and you dont gota worry about hittin it on rocks. Good luck
adam

YotaYota · « **Reply #29 on:** Feb 13, 2005, 07:16:05 AM »

Quote from: Hyena on Feb 12, 2005, 08:19:03 PM

Is there any way to take off the birfields without taking the axles out too? Is there enough room in the bell area for the birf to slide?

my inners are martacked, so i could take the bifs out w/out the axles but i cant turn them to line em up w/ the trunuion's....... ill try what thumper suggested today

Thanks for your input guys

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