Author Topic: toyota heavy duty at sema (Read 2520 times)

red · « **on:** Oct 30, 2007, 11:59:55 AM »

http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/autoshows/sema2007/toyota/tundradually1.html just a concept design but i already see a bunch of problems.
1. 8.0L diesel that only cranks out 600ft/lbs of torque. considering that gm, ford, and dodge are all up over 650 ft/lbs of torque with their current motors thats not good. keep in mind this is the tuned up 8.0L motor. life expectancy of up to 400k miles? sorry, but besides ford's 6.0L thats considered about standard lifetime expectancy from the diesels in stock form with basic maintenance.
2. allison does not make a manual tranny so the reporters are wrong there. 2nd on that, only a 5 speed? all of its competators have 6 speeds for closer gear ratio's when your pulling a heavy load, both auto and manual. so 1 of 3 things could be going on with the 5 speed. 1. no low range 1st gear. 2. no overdrive. or 3. wide gaps between the gears which is a killer when towing heavy loads. with an engine that red lines at 2600rpm's you need gear spacing fairly close.
3. lots of body designs fom dodge by the looks of it.
4. differant wheels front/rear. problem there is you have to carry 2 differant sized spare tires.

just a concept so hopefully they get these things straightened out.

tom w. · « **Reply #1 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 12:18:12 PM »

Not to mention it's pretty ugly to boot...

red · « **Reply #2 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 12:54:33 PM »

haha thats what i mean by #3.

the key things that they have to have in order to win anybody from the big 3 with heavy duty's:
1. has to be competative with torque
2. get similar fuel economy to at least ford, much better if they can compete with gm/dodge with fuel economy and power
3. a better quality auto than dodge has or at least a comparable stick shift 6 speed to the big 3
4. a solid bed unlike the latest tundra's. people complaining of large dents in the bed after hauling just a 4 wheeler (metal is too thin, not strong enough).
5. comparably priced. might be difficult for toyota since their tundra's are similarly priced to a luxery package gm and a base package ford in the 3/4-1 ton variant.
in order to have any chance in the heavy duty market they need to meet these goals. looks come down to personal preferance of course, but if they cant be competative in torque, fuel economy, cost, reliability (ford 6.0 and dodge auto tranny excluded from reliability), and a solid bed then they wont sell.

i dont doubt their claim that it can tow 24k pounds, ford and toyota are known to list the upper limit of their towing ability.

oddball · « **Reply #3 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 12:55:42 PM »

I know its only a concept but I agree its ugly as is the regular tundra, the engine is out of a hino commercial truck were the lack of tourque is probably made up for with low gearing

oddball · « **Reply #4 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 12:59:22 PM »

Im sure Allison only makes autos but thats kind of an odd looking shifter for an automatic

red · « **Reply #5 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 01:01:08 PM »

the base torque for that 8.0L is 520 according to toyota, they tuned it up to 600ft/lbs of torque. from an 8.0L that might be put into production in the next few years, thats pitiful. gm is putting a 4.5L duramax v8 into their 1/2 ton trucks, suburbans, and tahoes that is cranking out 520ft/lbs of torque, and in a reg cab pickup without the tow package is rated at 32mpg highway (actual road tests). toyota has alot of work to do.

it probably does have lower gearing in the axle, ford is doing the same thing.
gm/dodge, 3.73 axle ratio in the 1 ton
ford, 4.56
but just because it has lower gearing does not mean it pulls the load easier. in an equal test of 1 ton dually's ford pulled the load slowest of the big 3.

red · « **Reply #6 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 01:02:30 PM »

i'm thinking the concept has a 5 speed manual like they mentioned, just not allison. gm owns the light duty allison division completely (1/2, 3/4, 1 ton) so i highly doubt their going to let any other company have an allison behind it.

CTENG in KS · « **Reply #7 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 01:12:12 PM »

Latest word is that although showing at Sema, Toyota is likely leaving this on the concept shelf. They are very hesitant to go forward with the HD truck line at this point. That maybe why you see descrepancies and a lack of engine parity...you likely won't see this truck on the road any time soon. Shoot, that news was even in the latest 4wheeler mag.

kneedownnate · « **Reply #8 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 02:19:12 PM »

It seems that if toyota were to get serious about this they'd build their own diesel. They probably just used the hino due to availability, and seeing as it's a concept they don't want to dump mass piles of money into developing an engine that may never see use. Everybody knows toyota is fully capable of building engines with very good power. I still can't really see toyota going into this market though, it's already pretty competetive, but that could have been said before they ever released word of the tundras too...

kneedownnate · « **Reply #9 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 02:30:53 PM »

On a similar note http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/autoshows/sema2007/toyota/offroadconcept.html

unclejpl4x4 · « **Reply #10 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 03:45:15 PM »

UGLY if it looks like the current tundra i would say sweet but the round curvy shits got go.

+ i wana see extendcab long bed

red · « **Reply #11 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 04:31:51 PM »

for an offroad concept doesnt look like it has hardly any ground clearance. interior looks alot nicer than the 1 ton does though.

kneedownnate · « **Reply #12 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 04:58:45 PM »

Quote from: unclejpl4x4 on Oct 30, 2007, 03:45:15 PM

UGLY if it looks like the current tundra i would say sweet but the round curvy shits got go.

Well, kinda needs to be there since it has a wider stance!

Quote from: red on Oct 30, 2007, 04:31:51 PM

for an offroad concept doesnt look like it has hardly any ground clearance.

My thoughts exactly. Not sure if the everyday tundra has that black skirt under the body, but it kinda makes it look even lower too.

inmyownsummerami · « **Reply #13 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 09:23:08 PM »

That thing's FUGLY Yo!

I'm gonna guess that it is an Aisin trans., and who ever wrote the article figured "Aisin, Allison, same thing", you see that kind of stuff in automotive mags all the time. You don't need to know about cars to write about them.

topar · « **Reply #14 on:** Oct 30, 2007, 09:42:04 PM »

I like the Tundra with the matching trailer. Don't like the dually concept though.

DTB · « **Reply #15 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 11:35:25 AM »

Why they are not producing these things is beyond me...Toyota is missing out on a huge segment of loyal buyers. The only reasoning I can think of is that maybe Toyota is focusing efforts on gaining a foothold in the hybri market. dunno. I just know that as a Toyota stockholder, I feel like something is missing. heres the pics for the linky impaired>>

Check out the redline and top speed!

oddball · « **Reply #16 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 11:45:37 AM »

I drove a rental truck that was a Hino and it had similar top speed and RPM figures. It was pretty gutless even empty

oddball · « **Reply #17 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 11:51:09 AM »

Oh and Allison just so happens to be a partner of Hinohttp://www.hino.com/partners/story_165.php

DTB · « **Reply #18 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 11:57:54 AM »

Quote from: Peperoncini on Nov 01, 2007, 11:45:37 AM

I drove a rental truck that was a Hino and it had similar top speed and RPM figures. It was pretty gutless even empty

ya but did it have 600 ftlbs torque?

red · « **Reply #19 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 12:00:49 PM »

allison is the main medium/heavy duty onroad truck tranny manufacturer with automatics. allison does not make manual tranny's.

600ft/lbs of torque is over 45ft/lbs of torque lower than any 3/4-1 ton diesel compedator. duramax is over 660, cummins is at 650, ford is at 645. keep in mind these are stock numbers. stock number for the hino 8.0L is 520ft/lbs of torque. toyota tuned up this one to make 600.

oddball · « **Reply #20 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 12:01:19 PM »

It didnt feel like it

brainlessfool · « **Reply #21 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 08:11:50 PM »

tom w. · « **Reply #22 on:** Nov 01, 2007, 08:42:42 PM »

On second thought, the only thing that bothers me is the rear fenders.

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