Motor Oil Suggestions

[blackdiamond]

Here's my "problem."  I recently purchased a new Mazdaspeed 3 that requires 5w-30 API "SM" oil per the warranty.  The engine is a 2.3 turbo (15.6 psi).  Very soon I will also have my 89 4Runner with a freshly rebuilt 22RE.  The Mazda is currently running Quaker State conventional from the first dealer oil change at 750 miles and the 4Runner will be broken in with Mobil 5000.  Both will be swapped to synthetic after break-in and it would be ideal to run the same oil in both, but there's always a but...

Oil Choices for the 4Runner - Royal Purple (API certified SL only), Valvoline Synthetic MaxLife (API certified SL only) or something to match the Mazda.  I am also considering 10w-30 or 10w-40 instead of 5w-30.  The main difference between SL and the SM rated oils is a reduction in the friction reducing agents to "save" catalytic converters.  Royal Purple has said that they won't do SM because SL is inferior.  The Maxlife contains additional detergents to keep the engine clean, more friction reducing agents and the seal conditioner shouldn't hurt anything.  Valvoline says it can be used in new and rebuilt engines.  Royal Purple contains a higher percentage of moly than most which is also good.

Oil Choices for the Mazdaspeed - Mobil 1 (I recently learned that they are not 100% Group IV synthetic so they are doing the very thing they sued Castrol for in the past), Valvoline Synpower, Pennzoil Platinum (seems to be a great oil for the price), or Quaker State that the dealer offers.

I know that they would all serve me well, but any suggestions?  I'm hopefull to hear from crawlerdan on the turbo application.

   

 

[crawlerdan]

  someone say crawlerdan??...hmmm

ok im awake-question answered 2 ways first of which, i highly recomend running whatever ford or mazda recomends until warrenty is null and void ESPESIALLY in a turbo charged car, if "something" happens and they find a non-warrenty approved oil in your car-you sir are screwed-ask me how i know 
#2
other then that-i would run something similar to required afterwords-a full synthetic is nice-and capable of withstanding more heat under more abuse (turbo)-and would be fine in a 22re, although a heavier oil is recomended in a 22r with high miles. 10-30 ect. also remember that once a synthetic oil is intoduced to a system, it must be used for the duration of the motors life.

all this being said-if you want to run the same oil in both vehicles, i would recomend royal purple-it is by far the most researched and tested oil product that exists, infact, almost all other oils are made by royal purples "rejects", or "in pure" oils.  a nice royal purple 5-30, or 10-30, would suit both cars fine.

this is of coarse going to be a opinionated thread, like gas and tires, but that is my opinion.

please use what the dealer recomends in the new car, as paying 5k for a new block is, im sure, not your idea of fun should something happen

[crawlerdan]

oh ya, im sure you where waiting for this= i ran royal purple 15w-40 in my subaru turbo, that put down 362 horsepower at the wheels on a dyno...at 18psi...held up fantastically

[blackdiamond]

Royal Purple is API certified, but not to SM standards.  The Mazda requires SM oil.  The dealer uses Quaker State and under warranty I can run any API certified SM oil.

The 4Runner will be a fresh rebuild so I can run whatever I want.  It will likely be Royal Purple or the synthetic MaxLife depending on which one I find an easier source for.  I expect the 4Runner will only get the oil changed about every six months so cost isn't really significant factor.  I have always wanted to run Royal Purple so this may be my chance.

I'm not sure I agree that once an engine is switched to synthetic it can't go back to conventional.  I don't think a single oil manufacture would support that idea with the current oils.  I think that used to be a problem, but I don't plan on switching in any case.  If this were true, then purchasing a used car would be dangerous if you didn't know the type of oil it was maintained with.  I'm sure you know that most synthetics (Group III base oil) are petroleum and the Group IV (PAO) and Group V (PE) are the only "true" synthetic products.

[crawlerdan]

ya, ive always been told once you go synthetic dont go back, but that may be outdated.

like i said before, if mazda recomends quaker, might as well find one you like and stick to it for the life of the car.

[blackdiamond]

The Mazda dealership where I will be having it serviced uses Quaker State.  This is different than recommending Quaker State.  The manual says 5w-30 API SM oil.  I would happily use the Quaker State, but:

(1) At the last oil change we determined that the online service guide the tech's use list's 5w-20 oil in error so I expect I would always have to "watch dog" them to ensure they put in the correct weight oil.  The owners manual is clear that the 5w-20 is only for the non-turbo engine.  When I talked to the service manager he confirmed the error.

(2) I expect that the brand the dealer stocks will change based on who gives them the best deal.  Even though the formulations change, I would like to run the same brand for the life of the car once I switch to synthetic.

I'm leaning towards Valvoline for the Mazda.

Should I run 5w-30, 10w-30 or 10w-40 in the 4Runner?     

[crawlerdan]

The Mazda dealership where I will be having it serviced uses Quaker State.  This is different than recommending Quaker State.  The manual says 5w-30 API SM oil.  I would happily use the Quaker State, but:

(1) At the last oil change we determined that the online service guide the tech's use list's 5w-20 oil in error so I expect I would always have to "watch dog" them to ensure they put in the correct weight oil.  The owners manual is clear that the 5w-20 is only for the non-turbo engine.  When I talked to the service manager he confirmed the error.

(2) I expect that the brand the dealer stocks will change based on who gives them the best deal.  Even though the formulations change, I would like to run the same brand for the life of the car once I switch to synthetic.

I'm leaning towards Valvoline for the Mazda.

Should I run 5w-30, 10w-30 or 10w-40 in the 4Runner?     

10-30 or 10-40, i personally run 20-50 all seasons.....but thats just me.i think 10-30 is what toyota recomends in that motor...but then again...my 22re isnt really a toyota anymore

[jimbo74]

penzoil = quaker state

[blackdiamond]

penzoil = quaker state

They are the same parent company, but the testing done on the oils shows them to be different products.

[Duffil]

I say Valvoline 10w30 in the runner.  I dunno how near you are to a NAPA up there, but the NAPA brand oil IS Valvoline.  We have a synthetic line as well, and it is way cheaper than VV by name.  75-500 is a NAPA synthetic 10w30(the same as SynPower).  I can't find anything on Valvoline's web site as to what API Spec it is, but I can check tomorrow at work if you want. 

[Duffil]

ah-ha! here ya go:

edit: I'll still check the NAPA stuff.

[blackdiamond]

Thanks for the information.  I will have to check www.bobistheoilguy.com to see if they are indeed the same product or just made by the same manufacture.  I have heard this before.

I am thinking 5w-30 Synpower in the Mazda and 10w-30 or 10w-40 Royal Purple in the 4Runner.

I noticed tonight that the conventional/blend MaxLife is API SM/SL so I might be able to run the synthetic MaxLife in the Mazda but it does seem strange to run a high mileage oil in a new car.  I can't imagine that the seal conditioner would have any impact on the turbo.

[blackdiamond]

It appears that NAPA is Valvoline base oil with a weaker additive package.

[kneedownnate]

Very soon I will also have my 89 4Runner with a freshly rebuilt 22RE will be broken in with Mobil 5000

Is that a standard or synthetic?  I ask because you're not supposed to break an engine in with synthetic, rings won't seat correctly.  I'm sure you knew this though, just had to ask.  I like running redline, especially after what I've put it through, but don't like paying for it!

[blackdiamond]

Mobil Clean 5000 is a conventional oil.  The break-in process is faster with conventional, but some new cars actually come with synthetic in them.  The other factor is that the majority of synthetics are Group III which means that they are really a highly purified dino oil.

[rscalmo]

i think synthetic is over-rated. it lasts longer and has a higher viscosity but who really uses their oil to its full potential? we change our oil every 3-5 thousand miles which is no where close to how long regular oil can last. especially us guys who treat our trucks better than our own bodies. i change out all of the oils in my truck every time i change the engine oil just to be sure. you are wasting your money with synthetic.

[jimbo74]

dino oils these days are also nothing like the old school oils......

there have been so many advances in technology that todays dino oils are eons past old school synthetics.....

[blackdiamond]

you are wasting your money with synthetic.

You may be right, but once I switch to synthetic I will only be changing the oil once or twice a year so the cost is minimal.  The 4Runner won't get enough miles put on it to justify changes based on mileage unless I make a trip to Moab or the Rubicon.

[rscalmo]

does it make a difference if you put lower gears and a locker in it? should you use a different oil from 80-90? maybe a thicker oil because of the locker putting more force on everything?

one more thing: someone said that once you switch to synthetic you have to stay with synthetic. i have heard differently. and how can you explain synthetic blends? since it is a combination of the 2. thats where i think the oil industry just wants you to buy the expensive stuff. just like they did about changing your oil every 3000 miles. that was a complete lie. oil can last 2-3 times that long. if you look at the original manual for our trucks, the air filter and oil change intervals were bigger. why would it suddenly change?

[blackdiamond]

In a "splash" lubrication system like a differential, I think that the benefits of "thicker" oil is offset by the reduced amount of lubrication from the "thicker" oils resistence to being "splashed."

There used to be some concerns about seal comaptability with synthetic and there were problems with switching back to conventional.  I don't know of any concerns currently.  There are different types of synthetics: Group III that are basically highly purified conventional oil, Group IV that are PAO based oil (I think these were the major factor in the original problems with synthetics that have now be corrected with additives) and Group V that are PE based oil.  The majority of synthetics on the market are Group III.

If you want to see some  "oil geeks" check out www.bobistheoilguy.com

[kneedownnate]

you are wasting your money with synthetic.

I believe this is a matter of opinion.  Standard oils may have come a long way, and may well surpass the first synthetics, but you have to realize that the same technologies that help one advance can help the other as well.  Synthetics are better in vehicles that sit around for long periods of time because they don't have the same tendencies to break down over time.  I'd go so far as to say that a high percentage of people running synthetics do not need to, but I personally don't trust conventional in my bikes.  I religiously change my oil at or before 3,000 miles in the bike, and it comes out clean enough that I have no quams running it in the truck afterward.  Kinda helps justify the $7 a quart too.  :2cents:

[TurtleTappers91]

The 22re dosent need oil changes!
Just add more oil whenever it gets low.
Done this for 5 years so far...

[Volcom]

My 22RE doesn't need anything better than Castrol GTX.  It's not a super high HP, supercharged, turbo'ed race motor.  I think anything you put in it would work.

[Stinky]

i used to run mobil 1 0w40... buuut a gallon n a quart(to make at least 4.5 quarts) of 15w40 amsoil through napa at my employee cost is $5 cheaper than 5 quarts of mobil...so were throwin the amsoil in it...its a bit heavy, but i run the piss out of it n its gonna be summer in not too long... that n 4 hour drives where it RARELY goes under 3k on the highway, it should be perfect

$30 even for a gallon of 15w40 amsoil, a quart and a 1068 filter...

i dunno if any of u guys run a 1068 napa gold on ure 22r's or not, BUT it's the same thread n gasket size as a 1348(which is wat the stock toyota filter size is), but twice the size... just some extra info  for yalls....

[Duffil]

i used to run mobil 1 0w40... buuut a gallon n a quart(to make at least 4.5 quarts) of 15w40 amsoil through napa at my employee cost is $5 cheaper than 5 quarts of mobil...so were throwin the amsoil in it...its a bit heavy, but i run the piss out of it n its gonna be summer in not too long... that n 4 hour drives where it RARELY goes under 3k on the highway, it should be perfect

$30 even for a gallon of 15w40 amsoil, a quart and a 1068 filter...

i dunno if any of u guys run a 1068 napa gold on ure 22r's or not, BUT it's the same thread n gasket size as a 1348(which is wat the stock toyota filter size is), but twice the size... just some extra info  for yalls....

use the 1515...more capacity

[V-Man]

  Rotella 15-40.  Summer
  Rotella 0-30 . Winter.

  But then again I don't have to worry about warrenty.

[79coyotefrg]

Castrol GTX 20-50

[V-Man]

Castrol GTX 20-50

That's what I'm running in the Transmission for the Honda.. ...Ok I drop some in the motor too.  Works reall good. 

[jimbo74]

The 22re dosent need oil changes!
Just add more oil whenever it gets low.
Done this for 5 years so far...

im not cool with that..... what about your oil filter?

[kneedownnate]

i dunno if any of u guys run a 1068 napa gold on ure 22r's or not, BUT it's the same thread n gasket size as a 1348(which is wat the stock toyota filter size is), but twice the size... just some extra info  for yalls....

I think that's what our boat motors run at work.  Napa gold filters are WIX, right?