CLUTCH AND TRANNY PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rednk1980]

  So im having one hell of a time with my truck right now. I have a clutch that has maybe 1000 miles on it, dual cases that have about the same amount of miles and a transmission out of a 1984 toyota pick-up. My problem is that the clutch won't fully engage when i push the pedal in. I can go through the forward moving gears but when i put the tranny in first gear. it makes the truck move forward even with the clutch pedal to the floor. It also wont let me go into reverse without jamming the gear. Ive tried everything adjusting the clutch new master cylinder, and slave cylinder. i have bled the lines countless times and still it hasn't changed. As well as when i try to change my crawl box from hi to low it grinds those gears Im at my wits end with this truck. I really don't want to drop the tranny and cases because i don't have the proper tools to do so. Does anyone have any input on what might be the problem. Im out of options. Please Help. 

[olivedrab85]

Are you using the correct shift fork? My buddy had the same problem cause he used the wrong one, just an idea.

[rednk1980]

do yo mean the shift fork that engages the clutch? If That is what you mean then i believe so because its the one that came with the tranny.

[rednk1980]

any one have any more ideas before i start tearing into it. 

[79coyotefrg]

look and see that when the clutch is pressed  the  slave  moves,  then  see if  the  rod  between the fork  and  slave is tight,  if its not then  you probably  have the wrong fork

[rednk1980]

Glen, I checked the slave and it moves when the pedal is pushed in, and the bolt between the slave and fork is tight as well. However i can move the fork about an 1/8 of an inch up and down when there isn't any pressure on it. Is this good or bad or normal

[BigMike]

The fork should have plenty of free play when the clutch is engaged.

Note: Engaged = Locked/Clamped, Disengaged = Free Spinning/Slip

It sounds to me that your flywheel was improperly resurfaced. Umm, you did get it resurfaced when you installed the new clutch, right? If so, do you recall what the difference of the clutch surface to the pressure plate surface was? Factory is 0.020" (20-thousandths) and we like to surface them to about 0.026" to get more life from the clutch.

But even at 0.026", the clutch disengages just fine. So for your situation, it sounds like your flywheel has a difference (or stepping) of 0.030" or greater.

I can not comment on mixmatching forks because I do not know how much of a difference it will/will not make.

Good luck dude. Do you have any friends who have a Toyota 4WD? If so, then I would take a ruler and measure the distance their clutch fork moves between fully engaged and fully disengaged, and then compare the same to yours. That will remove any doubt about air in your lines or using the wrong parts.

BigMike

[fordh8r]

 X2 on all the previous post  . It sounds as if you haven't driven this since this problem started  . If you have, then does it slip when the engine revs in gear as if the clutch is bad? If so that is the other characteristic along with what you described for possibly broken clutch springs (pressure plate) which will warrant removal of the trans and cases. Broken clutch springs will only allow proper operation of a portion of the clutch cover and won't allow either proper engagement/disengagement of the clutch. In which case the input shaft won't stop spinning and cause your gears to grind or not allow full clamping pressure of the clutch disc and thus it will slip. Hope this offers some useful help. 

[rednk1980]

i've driven it a little since the problem started but it doesn't slip when im in gear and rev the engine up. from what you said it sounds like the springs on the pressure plate went bad. However i didn't have the flywheel resurfaced when the clutch was put on because the clutch was already on the motor when i got it and the guy i bought the motor from said that the clutch had only 1000 miles on it. Im thinking that either the pressure plate springs have gone bad or the fly wheel wasn't resurfaced correctly thanks for the help guys looks like the only way of finding out it to take the tranny out. However i think it will be easier to just pull the motor it is easier to put back in.

[BigMike]

I don't think it is bad springs or bushings. If so then you would hear it chatter and also it would not have a smooth engagement. It would be jerky under engagement.

Even if the springs were bad, they only control rotational movement, not axial. In other words, if you remove the springs, and then put the clutch back in, it will still yield the same problems that it is now.

However i think it will be easier to just pull the motor it is easier to put back in.

What? Are you serious?? I bet you could have the t/case and trans out in under 30 mins if you really tried.


BigMike

[rednk1980]

Well mike i dont have a tranny jack yet buy my dad just called and said he's picking one up tonight so ill drop the tranny. When the truck was in the shop and i was playing with the tranny and shifting gears (i know its bad for the tranny) it wasn't shifting smoothly. I was wondering if this is normal or is something breaking down in my tranny. Its a g52

[BigMike]

Sorry man, didn't mean to sound rude. Just to me it is much harder to pull the engine than it is to drop the drivetrain. I suppose a jack would definitely help

It is ok to shift gears on a transmission that is just sitting on the ground. If it is a rebuilt or new transmission, then all of the important parts will be pre lubricated. If it is a used trans, then all of the important parts will be pre worn.

In fact, you could drain your transmission gear oil, fire up your truck and with it idling, disengage your clutch, and cycle through the gears a couple of times. I have even moved a truck out of my garage before, that had No gear oil in the transmission or t/case. As long as you do this before anything gets heated up, its not going to ruin anything.

The same applies for installing a new/used engine. I will adjust the valves, and then fire up the engine WithOUT any coolant or water at all. I'll let the engine idle for a while to let it warm up. After a couple of mins I'll turn it off. Then I'll add the coolant while it is cooling down, and by that time, the valves will be ready to re-check and also re-torque the head.

I am sure these methods are NOT recommended by any Toyota manual or shop (including ours). I've done this to my own personal vehicles. But when you start worrying about the little things that don't matter, you'll miss the bigger picture.

If your transmission was shifting hard from the beginning, then I am sure that you have not done anything to it to make it worse.

I'll keep my money with the flywheel not being surfaced correctly or an incorrect fork. Check how far your fork physically moves and compare it with another Yota.

[rednk1980]

thanks for the help mike i really appreciate it.

[fordh8r]

Even if the springs were bad, they only control rotational movement, not axial. In other words, if you remove the springs, and then put the clutch back in, it will still yield the same problems that it is now.

BigMike

Big mike, I believe the springs you are reffering to are the springs in the disc itself. Which, yes, only dampen rotational engagement of the clutch. The springs I was referring to are the ones in the pressure plate that apply the clamping force to the disc. Just clarifying. Thanks! 

[79coyotefrg]

yes  the  disc springs  or  mostlikely  those rubber bushings    but  it sounds  more of a clutch disc installed backwards  or  at some point got VERY hot  and separated


OR  the fork is wrong,   when i installed  my L52SHD  i used a "modified"  fork pivot ball, this  was the only way i could use my L43 fork on my L52  tranny

[BigMike]

Big mike, I believe the springs you are reffering to are the springs in the disc itself. Which, yes, only dampen rotational engagement of the clutch. The springs I was referring to are the ones in the pressure plate that apply the clamping force to the disc. Just clarifying. Thanks! 

Ack

<--- BigMike

[FIREBALL]

One more thought, did you change the throw-out bearing when you put the clutch in? Could be the wrong bearing or the bearing could be on backwards. I had a similar but more extreme version of this problem when the fork slipped over the bearing because it was in backward. The clutch wouldn't disengage at all so I had to shut the truck off at stop signs and re-start in gear to get home.
Just another thought.....good luck!!

[rednk1980]

well i just got the tranny out and i found a few supprises. The throw out bearing isn't even close to the old one so im thinking that is the problem as well as the clutch seemed to have gotten really hot at some point. And some of the bolts that my crawlbox uses to bolt onto the tranny were either really loose or missing completly 

[BigMike]

Could be the wrong bearing or the bearing could be on backwards.

[rednk1980]

Thanks to all who helped i really appreciate the effort in trying to help me out. have a  if you don't drink have a PEPSI!

[BigMike]

or a dewski!

[FIREBALL]

Cool....havin a drink on you

[Stinky]

my truck did the same thing...it ended up being since my trans was from an 85 n the truck was an 87, SOMEHOW the slaves are different...after i got all the right stuff in it and all new lines ran, EXACTLY how it was from the factory in a normal 5-speed truck, i havent had a prob since...

i posted a thing up here a looooooooong time ago about wat all the symptoms were, look through my posts...unless ya got it all fingered out...

[rednk1980]

thanks for the help stinky but i got her figured out, the throwout bearing and clutch weren't for a 22r motor they were for a 20r (stupid people at autozone!) but she's all fixed now.