The all-new 1990 Daihatsu Rocky

[emsvitil]

Mazda 12A   peak torque 4000, peak HP 6000  (my 72 rx2 peaked at 6500 before headers, 7000 or more after headers)
Toyota 22R                     2800,             4800

[THK Matt]

Ive always heard the phrase in connection with chevys that sit there cranking for 30 seconds before the engine starts.

I can only imagine how it would be at -30 with no block heater. Probably not good for trying to get anywhere.

I, too, want to know why a 22R would be a horrible idea

if its taking 30seconds to start... bein a chevy ISNT the problem. 

[utherjorge]

From what I glean here (or have gleaned) the newer engines in good shape will be easier to find. looking at swaps it seems like if you're going to go with 120hp stock, and remember Lewis is already complaining that "haz no powr", a newer motor that can have "moar" would be what he wants to do. But I'm thinking I've figured Lewis out, so he'll try to drop in an air-cooled but motor and be confused why it's not better

/I own a Chevy with a 5.3 and it starts great

[Gnarly4X]

... But I'm thinking I've figured Lewis out, so he'll try to drop in an air-cooled but motor and be confused why it's not better

Are you just now figuring Lewis out?

What the hell is an "air-cooled but motor"??

Gnarls.

[Toybrota]

Does anyone else whip up a bowl of popcorn Everytime there is a new reply? This stuff is entertainment.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[Lewis Hein]

Does anyone else whip up a bowl of popcorn Everytime there is a new reply? This stuff is entertainment.

Toybrota is onto something here: the debate about what I might, could, or would do indeed has some entertainment value.

However, I'm not here to be entertained. I'm here to talk fixin' talk. Talk about me, while entertaining, won't put a new engine in my Daihatsu nor get the old one running. I have said this before in other discussions, but it bears repeating: I am totally ignorant and totally incompetent. I don't want to stay that way, though; telling me how ignorant and incompetent I am, while completely true, doesn't help me learn anything.

After some research today, the subaru engine is off the list. It's like the Wankel engine: Great sounding idea, but I fear it would be a nightmare in practice. A 4cyl cummins has joined the list, maybe. The Rocky is probably geared too low for it, and in might not even fit. And any big investment is going to have to wait, as the Toyota is first in line for having money spent on it. Meanwhile, I can toss around lots of crazy ideas and find the least crazy.

OK -- back to engine talk!

[Toybrota]

However, I'm not here to be entertained. I'm here to talk fixin' talk. Talk about me, while entertaining, won't put a new engine in my Daihatsu nor get the old one running. I have said this before in other discussions, but it bears repeating: I am totally ignorant and totally incompetent. I don't want to stay that way, though; telling me how ignorant and incompetent I am, while completely true, doesn't help me learn anything.

After some research today, the subaru engine is off the list. It's like the Wankel engine: Great sounding idea, but I fear it would be a nightmare in practice. A 4cyl cummins has joined the list, maybe. The Rocky is probably geared too low for it, and in might not even fit. And any big investment is going to have to wait, as the Toyota is first in line for having money spent on it. Meanwhile, I can toss around lots of crazy ideas and find the least crazy.

OK -- back to engine talk!

Sorry to get off topic! I just enjoy this, any time is guys argue about engines it just reminds me how lucky we all are we can even tinker with these things!

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[Toybrota]

In my opinion, a VW diesel would suit this thing so good, seems to be a popular swap in lots small 4X4's.

If it was me, I'd find a wrecked samurai and take the drivetrain out of it, trans and transfer case. And get a swap kit to make a VW diesel engine mount to it, similar sized vehicles so it would probably fit a little better compared to a bigger motor. 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[Lewis Hein]

if its taking 30seconds to start... bein a chevy ISNT the problem. 

OK, perhaps a chevy is further up on the list. However, I've heard it takes lots of lift to clear one..

A VW diesel is a new and attractive idea. I like diesels for some things, and a preexisting samurai swap kit might ease the process once I got the Suzuki gear in.

[Prismo]

Why would you consider a 22r when everyone knows they are unreliable 

[utherjorge]

Should have been "4-cyl VW motor." Apparently, somehow my phone atuocorrects VW to "But" haha

There's a clean looking VW diesel swap on craigslist, or was lately.

I was the one that told you that a Chevy motor requires a lot of lifts, jeez

I'll stop talking and start watching. My Rocky body lift is on the way from Australia, so I should have a real update shortly

[Gnarly4X]

Why would you consider a 22r when everyone knows they are unreliable 

Here a zing, there a zing, everywhere a zing-zing. Zingers... zingers are funny. 

Gnarls. 

[Lewis Hein]

I was the one that told you that a Chevy motor requires a lot of lifts, jeez

It's true, and I appreciate that. Warning me of this probably saved me lots of headache down the road, so thanks.

[redneckcustoms13]

If for some reason you decide to go with a samurai engine swap I have a samurai 1.3 with harley side draft carb and transmission sitting in my shed I'd let go of if you are interested.

[H8PVMNT]

That Suzuki engine might be a good option if it is done.  I would choose a nice carbed 22r or 20r/22r hybrid.  However, for the trouble a 2RZ or 3RZ would be great.  If you are not handy with wiring that may be a bad choice.

On thing about being inexperienced and ignorant...  Don't sweat it man, we all had to start somewhere.  Read manuals, peruse threads, make a choice that can be done and probably based on what is available and dive in.  You will screw up and learn on the way but it won't be the end of the world and when you get it done you will have something fairly unique and you will have the experience and confidence you lack.

You can do it!

[Lewis Hein]

I have wired machine tools, outlets, appliances, and other miscellany. Never an engine, but there's good instructions everywhere. If I don't try to wire an engine, when will I learn how?

The outlines of this project are beginning to take shape in my head. I've pretty much settled on a Toyota drivetrain because I know them best, and they have a decent reputation. A TDI engine would be nice, but I've heard a few horror stories about VW engines before.

Engine: Whatever fuel efficient 4 cylinder Toyota engine comes across my path first at a price I like. In order of descending preference: 20/22R, 2RZ, 22RE, 3RZ.
Transmission: Whatever is strong enough for the engine and can be attached with minimal hassle and expense.
Sorry, no SAS for a while. I'm not set up for that.

This may not happen for a while. My pickup is first in line for having money spent on it, and I want to have a go at making the current engine run well. If I can't make the current engine run well without lots of money, that will push the swap closer.

[H8PVMNT]

If I don't try to wire an engine, when will I learn how?

That's the spirit!

[Lewis Hein]

Breaking: I may have the chance to purchase a mazda diesel engine (built by perkins) with associated 2wd transmission at a reasonable price. Claimed 42 MPG, I am really dubious. Perhaps two digits got transposed?

If I did that, the build would look like this:

Maxda 2.2l diesel, with a mazda 2wd tranny and a ford or nissan divorced transfer case.


I will have to look into whether this will even fit. But before I do.... does anyone here have experience with the Mazda diesels and transmissions? Are they any good?

[utherjorge]

dude, you're talking about creating something that no one has ever done, and not in a good way.

Have you researched what all goes into an actual engine swap in a Rocky? I don't mean a sammie, or a Tracker/Sidekick, I mean a Rocky

EDIT: check out this page and see what people have done:
http://www.warfs.org/index.php?board=28.0

[Gnarly4X]

... On thing about being inexperienced and ignorant...  Don't sweat it man, we all had to start somewhere.  Read manuals, peruse threads, make a choice that can be done and probably based on what is available and dive in.  You will screw up and learn on the way but it won't be the end of the world and when you get it done you will have something fairly unique and you will have the experience and confidence you lack.

You can do it!

I 2nd that.

Gnarls.

[kneedownnate]

If it were me, I'd be really interested in contacting the guy with the craigslist ad I posted to see how much of a pita it was to swap in the vw diesel. 

[utherjorge]

i'll bet this is from one of the guys on WARFs that did the 22 swap:
https://anchorage.craigslist.org/cto/d/rock-daihatsu/6309961094.html

Here's the VW diesel:
https://redding.craigslist.org/cto/d/daihatsu-rocky/6304524709.html

One with a Chevy 350. note the lift it has
https://bgky.craigslist.org/cto/d/1990-daihatsu-rocky-like/6315965549.html

Some odd Daihatsus available in Canada, not sure if they could even be brought to America, though they are more than 25 years old. These just showed up:
https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/ctd/d/daihatsu-rugger-rocky/6294375262.html
https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/ctd/d/daihatsu-rugger-turbo/6294555993.html
https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/d/93-daihatsu-rugger-rocky-f70/6314613747.html

Quite a few with the stock motor, too, FWIW

[Lewis Hein]

Thanks for your input, guys. I've learned a lot.

I think the mazda/perkins swap would be about as much trouble as the VW swap, though with minor differences. But my best assessment of the situation is that I'd be spending around $4000 and several months whichever engine I put in. And at this point, I'd rather put my time and money towards making my Daihatsu mobile and my Toyota better, rather than having lots of non-mobile and almost good vehicles cluttering up the place. On top of that, winter is coming and wrenching at 10*F in the snow with a howling wind isn't much fun.

Someday when I don't have obligations 5-9 I'll swap an engine. Until then, I think my engines will have to stay factory spec or close.

[Lewis Hein]

I stole some time yesterday to work on the Daihatsu engine.

About a week and a half ago, I decided to get to the bottom of what was wrong with it. A cursory inspection revealed that there was a new batch of water in the oil, strongly suggesting a blown HG. Thus, over the past week or so I've been slowly working on getting the head loose. Come to find out, the head bolts were at wildly different tightnesses and the HG was pretty ratty looking. Now it has a nice, new ITM head gasket in there and the head bolts torqued to 61-65 newton-meters, as close to each other as I could get. We had the head loose a few days ago, so today we just had to pull it off, remove the surprise wires and hoses, and scrape, scrape, scrape. Meanwhile, the rain clouds came closer.... and closer... Finally, the scraping job was declared good and we put the new HG on. I tightened the bolts in 10 NM increments according to the sequence in the FSM, keeping one eye on the torque wrench and one on the clouds. Just as we were putting the valve cover back on, a few sprinkles started.

Some nice chilly day, I'll get it all hooked up again, change the oil and the filter, put the coolant back, and crank the starter. What will happen? Will it start?  Will it run well? Will it keep on running well? Will a new HG help the low-end torque? Tune in later to find out...

Until then, enjoy the suspense.

Lewis

[Toybrota]

I stole some time yesterday to work on the Daihatsu engine.

About a week and a half ago, I decided to get to the bottom of what was wrong with it. A cursory inspection revealed that there was a new batch of water in the oil, strongly suggesting a blown HG. Thus, over the past week or so I've been slowly working on getting the head loose. Come to find out, the head bolts were at wildly different tightnesses and the HG was pretty ratty looking. Now it has a nice, new ITM head gasket in there and the head bolts torqued to 61-65 newton-meters, as close to each other as I could get. We had the head loose a few days ago, so today we just had to pull it off, remove the surprise wires and hoses, and scrape, scrape, scrape. Meanwhile, the rain clouds came closer.... and closer... Finally, the scraping job was declared good and we put the new HG on. I tightened the bolts in 10 NM increments according to the sequence in the FSM, keeping one eye on the torque wrench and one on the clouds. Just as we were putting the valve cover back on, a few sprinkles started.

Some nice chilly day, I'll get it all hooked up again, change the oil and the filter, put the coolant back, and crank the starter. What will happen? Will it start?  Will it run well? Will it keep on running well? Will a new HG help the low-end torque? Tune in later to find out...

Until then, enjoy the suspense.

Lewis

Excited to see what happens!

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[THK Matt]

I stole some time yesterday to work on the Daihatsu engine.

About a week and a half ago, I decided to get to the bottom of what was wrong with it. A cursory inspection revealed that there was a new batch of water in the oil, strongly suggesting a blown HG. Thus, over the past week or so I've been slowly working on getting the head loose. Come to find out, the head bolts were at wildly different tightnesses and the HG was pretty ratty looking. Now it has a nice, new ITM head gasket in there and the head bolts torqued to 61-65 newton-meters, as close to each other as I could get. We had the head loose a few days ago, so today we just had to pull it off, remove the surprise wires and hoses, and scrape, scrape, scrape. Meanwhile, the rain clouds came closer.... and closer... Finally, the scraping job was declared good and we put the new HG on. I tightened the bolts in 10 NM increments according to the sequence in the FSM, keeping one eye on the torque wrench and one on the clouds. Just as we were putting the valve cover back on, a few sprinkles started.

Some nice chilly day, I'll get it all hooked up again, change the oil and the filter, put the coolant back, and crank the starter. What will happen? Will it start?  Will it run well? Will it keep on running well? Will a new HG help the low-end torque? Tune in later to find out...

Until then, enjoy the suspense.

Lewis

I would get some motor flush. and flush your radiator. prior to starting it.

[Lewis Hein]

I'm confused. Why flush the radiator??

I'm sure you have a reason, but I don't understand it.

[THK Matt]

I'm confused. Why flush the radiator??

I'm sure you have a reason, but I don't understand it.

if you havd a blown HG and have water in your oil, its a good assumption there would be oil in your coolant too.

[Lewis Hein]

Right, but would that really clog the radiator? There's probably oil in the coolant, but it is not an obviously large amount

[Toybrota]

Right, but would that really clog the radiator? There's probably oil in the coolant, but it is not an obviously large amount

Better safe than sorry, coolant isn't supposed to have oil in it. It's real simple to do.


Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk