Topic: Fixed gear reducing 2.5:1

[jan]

Hello all,

Yes, I'm a newbie. So newbie I don't even understand the jargon that's used in marlin's product descriptions. I do understand English pretty well, if I may say so, but not to the level that is required for this subject. Not even close.

I come here because I'm researching a gear-reduction problem for my BJ40 from 1977. That's a FJ40 with a diessel engine instead of petrol. It's not because I want to crawl. But it is because my new motor has a rpm range up to 10.000 rpm. And a peak torque of 300Nm from zero to 4000 rpm. Beyond that the torue decreases, but the power stays more or less the same. For this it doesn't need a gearbox anymore. A fixed reduction of 2.5:1 is more than enough. That's 750Nm from zero in high gear, and 1800Nm in low gear. That would be prety awesome.

What are my options?

I've researched changing gears in the transfer case, but came nowhere near a 2.5:1 reduction. And I'm under the impression they don't really exists anymore for a BJ40 or FJ40 from '77.

The toybox seems to me the closest thing to a solution for my problem. But I don't understand its specs exactly. Is it available for a BJ40 from 77 and does it come close to a 2.5:1 reduction? And does it come with adapters for a FJ40 or is it build for a FJ40?

Regards,
Jan

[jan [OP]]

Not much help yet. Maybe I’m in the wrong place. Maybe there is a newerbie questions forum.

I’ll try to understand the product description once again. And show where I get all confused over the place. I’ll go sentence by sentence.

“This is our Rubicon proven ToyBox dual transfer case low range gear reduction system.“

Hail wiki.

Rubicon proven means it is used on a trip on the Rubicon Trail. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubicon_Trail
OK.

This ‘dual case’ confuses people besides me to. I think the ToyBox *is* the dual or second case. Other people, I asked reading this product description, think it is only an adapter between two (not included) transfer cases.

I believe it is the second or dual transfer case. With the reduction gears build inside of it. Right or wrong?

“The ToyBox is more than just a dual case adapter. It is a system that installs a Toyota pickup low range reduction unit behind 8 different transmission applications. “

This makes it not really clearer to me. It now explicitly says it is really *just* an adapter between two not included cases. But it has a nice feature: you can choose from a lot of different not included cases.

So, it is just an adapter.

And those nice features are only for a Toyota Pickup. What’s a Toyota Pickup?
The FJ40 can be build into a pickup. But what’s it got to do with that?

Bad news. Totally confused.

Next.

“It can be built with a 2.28:1 or a 4.70:1 reduction ratio. “

Now I’m under the impression again, that it’s not just an adapter. It has its own gearing. But I’ll never be sure, I guess.

What do they mean?
•   With this adapter you can couple two boxes with the mentioned ratios.
•   This adapter comes as a kit of parts, and you can built it into one of the mentioned ratios.
•   You can order the product with one of the mentioned ratios, and we build it for you.

2 out of 3 options give me the idea it’s more than an adapter.  But not clear. Not at all.

“Available as a kit or as a completely assembled bolt in unit”

This could be a rephrasing of my last two options I understood from the prior sentence. But it can also mean:
•   You can buy the damn thing from us and do what you want.
•   Come with your Toyota ‘pickup’, and we do our magic trick.

Not sure. Next.

“It features helically cut high performance gears that we have sourced from Toyota's own gear cutter in Japan. They offer the highest level of strength while minimizing gear noise and whine.”

I don’t know what helically means, but I don’t think that’s important. It just sounds good. What it does or  is, I’m not sure of. But it is just plain rock solid good stuff.

“The ToyBox is placed between your transmission and transfer case and features a 128% or 370% lower gear reduction.”

Now I’m back again at being sure, it is *not* just an adapter. It is also an adapter because it is placed between the gearbox and the transfer case. And the gearbox faces can be customized to adapt to 8 different gear boxes. That’s what I think now. I’m pretty sure.

But all of a sudden I’m confronted with a totally different way of reduction units: Percentages. And I can make no sense out of them. Is 128% the same as 2.28:1? And 370% is 4.7:1? I am not able to calculate anything sensible with those two percentages.

And what is also totally unclear to me: Are those two reductions selectable with a shifter, or must I choose when I order?

One sentence that gives me hope again, and at the same time leaves me extra confused lying on the ground. Powerful sentence.

“ The rear adapter plate will enable a 3- or 4-speed style Land Cruiser one piece transfer case to bolt directly behind the proven reliability of a Toyota gear driven transfer case reduction box. “

I give up. No idea.

“The length of the ToyBox's adapter plates are 1.2" for the front, and 1.35" for the rear, creating an overall length of just 6.75" (for manual applications). Automatic applications are slightly longer.”

Clear. I understand this sentence completely. OK,I have to convert the archaic units to modern ones. But that’s no problem. And I know mine is not automatic. So, I now know exactly the length of the unit. That is quit important. Feels good to understand something again. 

“ The ToyBox features a top mounted shift handle…“

Simple! Right. Clear. I can live with that.

“…and has provisions for adding an additional crossmember mount for increased drive train support.“

Harder to understand. I think there is an optional piece of steal that’s called a crossmember and mounts the toybox onto the chassis. I suppose there are prepared bolting holes for that crossmember. OK. That could be important for me. I have still an issue of mounting my new motor.

“Also, the ToyBox shares its oil with the transmission prolonging both the transmission and the ToyBox's life with cooler oil under operating temperatures.”

I feel I’ve taken a hurdle somewhere. All of a sudden sentences make sense to me. 

I have no gearbox anymore. But I have to think about this. I suppose the gearbox face is open, just like the transfer case I have.

Next.

“Power Transfer Paths
High Range   1.00:1   
Low Range   2.28:1   Standard
Low Range   4.70:1   (Optional)”

This feels good. What I believe now:
•   It’s a gear reduction unit
•   It can be mounted as an adapter between the standard FJ40 transfer case and many (8) different gearboxes.
•   It has minimal two ranges, and an optional third.
•   Or it has always two ranges, a high 1:1, and a low that can be 2.28:1 or 4.7:1.

This is what I need.  I can live with 2.28. I rather had 2.5. But it’s ok.

“The ToyBox offers flexible gear ratio options. The standard low range is a 2.28:1, with an optional ratio of 4.70:1. “

Yeah, I understood that. And it’s still not clear if that 4.7 is an extra third, or replaces the 2.28 option.

Doesn’t matter. From what I understand now, I still want it. If it can handle 10.000 rpm for short periodes.

That is, If I understand it correctly. Some confirmation would be appreciated.

“The high range ratio of 1.00:1 is standard on all ToyBox setups, and when engaged, allows the power to transfer straight through the unit without any change in the vehicle's original speed.”

Clear. I think. High (1:1) is established without gears. Fine.

I skip the example.

So, am I right or wrong? And can it handle high RPM’s? Really high, like 10.000 rpm. Probably not, I guess.

And why does the website says: “Pricing and Information Coming Soon!”
I’ve seen the Toybox mentioned on forums as early as in 2007. 6 years later prices and information are still on its way?

[Cheesemaker]

I'm trying to understand what you are asking. 

Ok, you have a BJ40 with a high performance diesel behind it (in US most diesels redline RPM is around 4,000) and your looking for a reduction box? 
But your only running a rear wheel drive at this point?  (2 wheel drive only)

And you want to go slower, faster or increase your torque from your motor?  Because we run lower gears, and/or additional transfer cases to get our wheel speed lower, all the while doubling our torque to the tires.  By reducing our tire speed, we can keep our rpm's up, and tire speed down.  Sometimes too much tire speed will break things.  So, we want to control the speed our tires are trying to grab at things. 
The Toybox is designed to go between the transmission and transfer case.  It isn't designed as the final output to a driveline. 
But this company makes a overdrive/underdrive as a final output.  Which maybe what your looking for.  http://www.gearvendors.com/

We need to know what your plans are for your vehicle to help you figure out what you are needing. 
As for the amount of RPM's the Toybox can handle, that answer needs to come from Marlin or Mike the company owners.

[H8PVMNT]

The Toyota Pickup is your "Hi-Lux".  So you are using the gear reduction part of the Hi-Lux transfer case between your exsisting transfer case and you transmition to have high range, low range and super low range for serious low geared crawling.

This kind of gear reduction is really astonishing and awesome if you do any kind of 4WD recreation beyond mud racing. It's even kind of handy on work trucks.  You should probably buy it...