Author Topic: Somewhat new clutch chatter and other questions. Almost at 400k. (Read 3096 times)

LotOMiles · « **on:** Aug 02, 2007, 11:47:32 AM »

Cool board. I would like to pick the collective brain of this board and bounce a few questions off ya. I am trying to keep my little Toyota running forever, but I am having drive line issues.

My truck is a '93 4x4 with the 3L and R150 5sp.

At 340k, the clutch pressure plate gave up the ghost. Foot down on clutch, but nothing happened. Since to this point, the clutch had not been touched, I replaced the clutch, pressure place, bearings, and had the flywheel resurfaced. All factory parts. All was well and good, but now at 375k, I am getting a bit of clutch chatter. Not a lot and it really takes starting from a stop on the right hill to make it do it, but the second before it grabs fully, it will chatter.

What is the source of the chatter? It never did this on the old clutch. I have not smoked it or changed the way I drive. No oil has gotten on it and I have not driven the truck in any deep water. It's not a bad chatter, but I ask because right now, I can get easy access to it because I have the transmission off.

On to the second question.
I am looking at buying a rebuild kit for the 150 from Marlin here. The bearings on the input shaft are gone. With the high miles on the thing, I figured I would just rebuild the entire thing with all new bearings and syncs.
I split the case on it last night. The gears looks to be in good shape, with the exception of a few of the gears having nicks in them. It's just the larger straight cut gears. Is this anything I should be worried about?

Also, reverse is somewhat gone in the thing. For the past 100k or so, I have to put it in 2nd, then reverse or it will grind going into reverse. Will the rebuild kit fix this, or is this a different issue?

Thanks for the help.

79coyotefrg · « **Reply #1 on:** Aug 02, 2007, 12:02:57 PM »

with that many miles i would suggest sending it to Marlin and having them completely go thru it

clutch ? was it factory TOYOTA parts from your dealer or was it OEM from a parts house ??

also when the flywheel was resurfaced was it stepped?? if not thats why you have the chatter

LotOMiles · « **Reply #2 on:** Aug 02, 2007, 12:56:14 PM »

I am thinking about sending it to Marlin, but then I would be missing out on the learning experience of doing it myself. Not sure.

Since I got such long life out of the factory parts, I only use factory Toyota parts. The guys at the Toyota dealer know me by name.

I got the flywheel resurfaced at a local shop by and 80 year old guy working on a 1950 machine. He didn't step the flywheel at all. The flywheel I took off did not have a factory step in it. It still had a few of the cracks after the resurfacing, but not deep. Perhaps it time for a new flywheel then?

Thanks for the help.

79coyotefrg · « **Reply #3 on:** Aug 02, 2007, 12:59:05 PM »

i know on a 22R they dont have a noticeable step but when resurfacing Marlin always does a .026 inch step

i did the same with mine and its awesome

Duffil · « **Reply #4 on:** Aug 02, 2007, 01:46:59 PM »

Quote from: 79coyotefrg on Aug 02, 2007, 12:59:05 PM

i know on a 22R they dont have a noticeable step but when resurfacing Marlin always does a .026 inch step

i did the same with mine and its awesome

As does my local machinist. You need that step.

LotOMiles · « **Reply #5 on:** Aug 03, 2007, 01:18:50 AM »

Frankly, I didn't think the engine was going to pass smog again or I would have replaced the flywheel. But last month, it passed with flying colors. I can't get that engine to die.

So I will order a flywheel from Marlin. I am assuming the pressure plate and clutch will be OK.

Last question. How long do the transfer cases last? It's the chain type. Can I remove it without taking off the transmission?

Thanks for the help.

LotOMiles · « **Reply #6 on:** Sep 08, 2007, 08:48:13 PM »

I am in the middle of the R150 rebuild. I think I found the source of the Model A cross cut gears sound.

This bearing seems to be missing something. New bearing on right.

Surprising for all the shrapnel this released, all I see is a few chips in the bigger gears and a mass of mangled metal on the magnet.

The rest of the tranny looks great. I figured this thing would be a slop bucket by now, but I have to be real careful as almost everything I take out (bearings and syncs) looks a lot like the brand new parts I am putting in. It's easy to get them mixed up.

emsvitil · « **Reply #7 on:** Sep 08, 2007, 11:43:08 PM »

Chips on the corners of the gears are ok (where there isn't any gear to gear contact)

Just dremel them smooth.

Post a picture of your reverse gear(s) where you think you have problems....

LotOMiles · « **Reply #8 on:** Sep 09, 2007, 08:32:34 PM »

I made a mistake. It's not the larger cross cut gears that have chips in them. It's two of the others. I don't have the manual in front of me so I don't know what they are called.

This one has about 4 nice size nicks in it.

The small 5th gear is also chewed up on the edges. I am just going to replace both to be on the safe side.

emsvitil · « **Reply #9 on:** Sep 09, 2007, 08:41:48 PM »

The small marks all the way around are machining marks, no problem......

That chips pretty bad, I'd only dremel it if it was reverse and be done with it.

If the other chips are less than 1/3 - 1/4 the length of the one shown, I'd dremel them and put them in....

Are they on the power transmission side of the gear or the coast side of the gear?

LotOMiles · « **Reply #10 on:** Sep 09, 2007, 11:20:01 PM »

The gear has 3 chips all about that size. I think one is larger. It also has some smaller nicks.

I think it's on the power side of the gear. Not sure tho.

I forgot to order a bearing, so I will just order the two new gears then. Hoping Toyota does not charge 200 bucks for them.
Also need to order a C-clip. One shot off and has yet to land.

*ROKTOY* · « **Reply #11 on:** Sep 10, 2007, 09:10:32 AM »

Hate to burst your bubble but Toyota will want close to $300 for each gear. As far as the c-clip goes it has definitely landed, gravity is a bi*ch.

emsvitil · « **Reply #12 on:** Sep 10, 2007, 01:41:02 PM »

Call Marlin for the gears (and the clip (get a spare)).....

LotOMiles · « **Reply #13 on:** Sep 13, 2007, 09:54:30 AM »

3rd gear, the one with a lot of chiped teeth, was 150 bucks. I am debating replacing 5th. Only some smaller chips on it.

emsvitil · « **Reply #14 on:** Sep 13, 2007, 01:30:24 PM »

Quote from: LotOMiles on Sep 13, 2007, 09:54:30 AM

3rd gear, the one with a lot of chiped teeth, was 150 bucks. I am debating replacing 5th. Only some smaller chips on it.

post a picture of the worse part....

Plekto · « **Reply #15 on:** Sep 13, 2007, 04:29:02 PM »

IME, it's always good to fix any damage when you can, no matter how minor(unless it's REALLY of no consequence at all)

LotOMiles · « **Reply #16 on:** Sep 13, 2007, 06:25:37 PM »

I think it's still good.

I will get a real photo tomorrow.

Normally I would take my time with this and do it right, but I am in a bit of a rush since I wasted so much time waiting for the MC rebuild.

LotOMiles · « **Reply #17 on:** Sep 15, 2007, 11:28:22 PM »

This is the worst of it.

Since I needed some more c-clips, I ordered a new 5th gear too. But this came.

New gear on left. What do you guys make of it? Next to the missing splines, it's the same gear. It pressed on fine, but I still have time to remove it. I forgot to order two of the bearings so no install this weekend. Toyota should make a bearing kit or something. All the bearings under one part number.

Oh-well. I made some good progress cleaning stuff and working on the AC. Got to get that R134 conversion done sometime.

emsvitil · « **Reply #18 on:** Sep 16, 2007, 12:39:01 AM »

Well if it was just the chips I would have dremeled them smooth since there's usually no tooth contact the close to the edge with helical cut gears.

It's the pits in the teeth that get to me.........

If you got the gear from Toyota, I wouldn't worry about it...

LotOMiles · « **Reply #19 on:** Sep 22, 2007, 02:33:57 PM »

Tranny rebuilt, assembled, and back in truck. It works perfect. A little tight, but it will loosen up.
I also put a new starter in at the same time, and pushed the ADD hoses against the exhaust manifold and didn't realize it. So no 4x4 till I get some new hoses. Today, I played around in the dirt a bit and got a photo of the road scared beast for ya.

I would put it up aginst any domestic truck with 375k any day. Oh, wait, they don't exist.

Thanks for all the help guys.

Duffil · « **Reply #20 on:** Sep 23, 2007, 03:24:28 PM »

Quote from: LotOMiles on Sep 22, 2007, 02:33:57 PM

I would put it up aginst any domestic truck with 375k any day. Oh, wait, they don't exist.

Thanks for all the help guys.

Hang on, I'll go grab a Cummins.

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