Topic: 4runner transfer case question

[eric91]

im new here and had some questions about a 1995 4runner. my understanding is that the transfercase on a 95 4runner with a 5 speed should be a vf1a which is chain driven. can i swap it out for a gear driven rf1a? is there any problem with this?

[jimbo74]

it isnt just going to swap out, engines and transmissions are different as well

[eric91 [OP]]

the current engine and transmission setup is a 3vze and an r150f. what would i have to change?

[Snowtoy]

Nothing has to change, just that the gear driven t-case wont bolt to the transmission w/o using thisTransfer Case Adapter as well.  The adapter plate will bolt in between the transmission and the transfer case.

If you aren't going to go with a 4.7 gear in the gear driven t-case or plan to go duals in the future, there really isn't a reason to swap the chain driven t-case for a gear driven one.

[eric91 [OP]]

thanks for the link. i plan on regearing the case and would like to install duals someday but i have as much money as any other highschool kid does which means my pockets are empty most of the time so that means stuff gets done one step at a time

i am also curious when it comes to the hubs on front. if im not mistaken i can put manual lockers on in place of the auto locking factory hubs?

[Snowtoy]

Yes you can install manual hubs.  A search here or on Pirate should turn up the swap.  IIRC it is a pretty straight forward swap.

If your Runner is stock or close to it, the $1200 for the adapter plate and 4.7 geared t-case(new prices) would be better spent on body armor, bumpers, winch, or correct gearing for the tires you are running.

[eric91 [OP]]

i will definatly take that into consideration. is there anthing i should be watching out for on a 4runner?

[Snowtoy]

The 3.0 does have some issues with burning exhaust valves and had an issue w/ the head gasket.  The head gasket issue has been resolved through the recall.  Most of the reoccurring head gasket issues(other than warped heads) was caused from re-using the oem torque-to-yield head bolts.  TTY bolts are a one time use bolt since they stretch when torquing them, from the dealer they run about $8 each, so most just reused them either because they were cheap or didn't know they weren't re-usable. 

I have had my '90 since it was new, never had an issue w/the head gasket, only the burnt exhaust valves, first time was in '98 and again in '04.  In '04 I installed a set of headers and haven't had any problem since.  Of course this could just be coincidental. 

The other thing to look out for is the timing belt.  Toyota recommends changing it every 80k miles, and unfortunately unlike the timing chain on the 22r(e)'s there isn't any rattle to let you know it is time for a change. 

If you aren't sure of the service history of the Runner and depending on its mileage, I would recommend changing the T-belt and possibly having a valve adjustment done.

[eric91 [OP]]

ok thaks for the info. i knew about the head gasket issue but had no idea it was possibly cause by the head bolts. so the 4runner was an offer i recieved for my truck and i recently got an offer for an 84 toyota truck. it is an ext cab and is lifted on 35s and was regeared to 529. anything i should be weary of with that truck?

[Snowtoy]

The transmission would be my only concern.  The older transmissions aren't as durable as the late '80's early '90's, but it wouldn't be enough of a concern to pass on the truck.  You can get the later model transmissions for under $200, and depending on its mileage, it may no longer have the original transmission.  If you aren't aware of the procedure to test the transmission w/o road noise, you can shift the transfer case into neutral, and with the engine running shift through through the gears as if you were driving the truck.  The '84-'85 X-cab are one of the favored year Toyota's to build, you get the extra room of the X-cab and they are the only 2nd gens to have a straight axle.  A set of dual cases(21 spline) will bolt right up, and rather than doing an SAS you only have to replace the weak links in the SA, i.e, birfield joint, knuckle studs, push pull steering, etc. and a lot cheaper in the long run to build one over the 3.0 Runner.

From what I understand the HG issue was originally caused by the ban here in the U.S. of using asbestos in the gaskets, and Toyota didn't account for it.  The 7m engines suffered from the same problem, a higher torque value resolved their issue.  TTY bolts were used on the 3.0 due to the design of the intake.  Where you normally go back in and re-torque head bolts after a few warm-up cool down cycles, having to remove the intake system makes it a longer job.  Many owners of the 3.0 have been able to put 2-300k on their engines w/o the HG failing.

The only other issue I didn't mention w/the Runner is recall for the steering relay rod which is applicable to all the 3rd gen rigs('89-95 non-Tacoma) and all 2nd gen Runners('90-'95).  The rods are cast and they have been prone to break at the pitman arm.  The recall started in late '05 or early '06 and is still in effect as far as I know.  I was fortunate with mine, it had apparently cracked(you can see the age patterns in the pic) long before it finally broke.  When it broke I had just as entered the trail, anywhere else along the way and the truck would have likely been been totaled.

Give Toyota a call to see if the steering relay rod recall has been done on the Runner, it wont cost you anything to have it done, and normally takes about 3hrs.

[eric91 [OP]]

thanks for all the info. the guy who had offered me the runner backed out which i am ok with cause i would really like the truck alot more. you said to go through the gears with the transfercase in nuetral, what am i looking/listening for?

[Snowtoy]

You are just listening for any odd sounding noise, i.e. a whine, grinding, something other than normal mechanical operating sound, or flopping around of the shifter.  All you should really hear is just the whir of the transmission and engine noise.  With the test drive the shifter shouldn't flop around or pop out of gear either.  If it does it could be as simple as replacing the shifter bushings or an indication of needing a rebuild.

As I mentioned above, if there are any issues w/the transmission, I wouldn't walk away from the deal(if you want the truck), you can always use the issues to negotiate a better trade.

[eric91 [OP]]

after much thinking and talking to myself i have decided not to get the 84 but im going with a different 4runner. the 84 just isnt as practical as a 4ruuner for me right now.

so back to the topic of a 4runner. is there anyway to fix the 4runner squat? i want to twin stick the trasnfer case as well. im not going to do anything major at this point but i do like to be able to choose what my vechile is going to do so the twin stick is going to give me more options.

[Snowtoy]

Depending on what year runner it is.  If it has rear leaf springs, you can add an additional main leaf spring to he rear leaves(under $50 using a set of junkyard springs).  If it has coil springs in the rear, you can either get a spacer, or buy new coils.  Either way, you only have to lift the rear half of the amount it is off from the front.  For example, if the front is 6" between top of tire and wheel well and the rear is 4", you only have to lift the rear 1", since the front will lower 1".

Twin sticks would be an easy upgrade, however w/manual hubs, you can have low 2wd, just the front drive line will turn.

The '84-'85 4 Runners were the only years that came w/a straight front axle.  The '84-'88's only had a 22r(e)'s, and the '89 had either a 22r(e) or the 3.0, the same for the 2nd gen('90-'95).  I can't remember if it was '91 or '92 when the rears went from leaf springs to coil springs. 

[eric91 [OP]]

the 4runner is a 1990. yeah i im definatly going with twin sticks, and if my wallet allows me i would like to put manual hubs on as well. i know there isnt that big of a performance market for the 3vze but is there anything else other than exhaust and intake i can do to squeeze more power/milage out of the v6?

[Snowtoy]

Manual hubs shouldn't be all that much, should be able to find them used for about $25 each.  Check the parts for sale section here and on Pirate, most don't reuse them when doing an SAS.

The 3.0 isn't a cheap engine to build, and you don't get a lot of bang for your buck, and if it is an auto you shouldn't even try.  Any one item you upgrade the 3.0 w/wont make a lot of difference.

I started out w/a K&NFIPK, then added a Jacob's Ignition system, next went on an electric fan, then turned the K&N system into a true cold air intake system, and in '04 added headers/hi-flow cat/turbo muffler.  I can't say how this would work on a stock bored motor, mine as bored .020 over after I hydro locked it on a failed river x-ing in '90.  But with these mod's, my '90 weighing about 4500lbs w/o gear averages about 17 mpg(21-23 on highway), and when loaded w/an extra 500lbs of gear for camping, I can easily climb the Sierra's to 7'ft and maintain 65-70mph doing it.  Over the years I probably spent about $2k building the 3.0(not including engine rebuild cost), today it would be about the same to do a 3.4 swap.

The best thing to do is make sure it is tuned up and you are running the right gears for the tires, i.e. 5-spd 4.56's for 31-32's, 4.88's for 33's, etc, and if auto you will need 4.88's for 31's and 5.29's for 33's.  Then improve the intake and exhaust.  I wouldn't put on a hi-flow muffler, I did that w/the headers and my mpg's dropped about 2/gl, and had dismal torque on take off.  I replaced the hi-flow w/a cheap turbo muffler and my mpg'/take off torque returned.  Other than that it would be better to just save -up for a 3.4 or straight 6 swap, costs would be about the same.

[eric91 [OP]]

if im not mistaken the 3.4 is the 5vz right? didnt that come in later year 4runners?

[overrocks]

yes

[overrocks]

thats whats in my 99

[overrocks]

its a great motor!

[overrocks]

the newwer 4.0 seem to run strong too

[Snowtoy]

if im not mistaken the 3.4 is the 5vz right? didnt that come in later year 4runners?

Yes, it debuted in the 1st gen Tacoma's, 3rd gen Runners, and I think the 1st gen Tundra.  It has become a much cheaper swap to do over the last few years then it used to be, and would be a better bang for your buck than trying to build the 3.0.

Depending on what your budget is, you might look into a 1st gen Tacoma's or 3rd gen Runners, the older ones are starting to sell for around $5k, sometimes less.  They don't don't appear to be holding their value as well as the older Toyota's.  However, I don't believe this has to do w/quality being less, a couple of buddies and family members have had a few over the years, and they have proven to be just as reliable as the the older Toys.  I think the that since they were built here in the U.S. and weren't applicable to the 25% import tax, as ones made in Japan were, so Toyota sold more of them new, making more available on the used market.

[eric91 [OP]]

so i was doing a little research and came up with a few questions. i like the idea of swapping a 5vz into the 4runner, but i saw a 3vz-fe last night which i learned went into the camrays, its suppose to use the same block as the 3vz-e, do you think the fe would bolt to the 5 speed transmission? the fe was suppose to have a good deal more power than the 3vze.

[Snowtoy]

Nope, it is set up for a fwd car.  If it was a bolt-up application, the 3.4 swap wouldn't have become so popular, given the availability of 3vzfe engines.  There have been a few attempts to mount the FE heads to the truck 3.0, none have been completed.  The last guy was looking for donations to help finish the project.  IIRC, he was on Yotatech, a search might turn up the post.

There aren't a lot of options for the 3.0, a full performance rebuild can yield good performance gains.  I am quite happy w/what I have done over the last 20yrs, but it wasn't cheap, and if i had to do it again I would opt for a 7mge or 2jzg straight 6 engine, from a Supra.  I plan to swap in a 7mge into my '91(22re) once I am finished restoring my '87 Supra, the 7mge is a 200/197 hp/trq engine, and i t will bolt right to the 22re transmissions(can't remember off hand which bell housing has to be used).

[eric91 [OP]]

yeah i guess that does make sense on why the 3.4 is a popular swap. yeah ive seen the 7m and 2jz sawps beforem, i know quite a bit about those because i was huge into "tuner" cars before i got into diesel. why dont more people do 1jz swap? they are ususally cheaper and easier to find than a 2jz. the 7m is a good motor too.