Rearend choice

[snowplow]

Hey dudes, Im just thinking ahead here and I wanted some feedback.

I got a 93 pickup, SAS HP, Longfield'd, elock'd, 37X14.5, Had toy 5 speed-going to a NP 435 4 speed, and I have ran a sb ford for almost the last 4 years. I am doing a new motor and stepping up to the big table now. 418w stroker (351w) should put out around 500 ft lbs.

I know the toy rears especially are VERY strong, as I try to break it daily. I do have total faith in the axles, but Im worried about the ring gear (4.88 now - will probably go to a 4.11)

Should I

1. run it till she blows  (IF she blows) - but if It all goes to hell, I cant sell my sweet rear...
2. swap a ford 9" with 35 sp axles (easy to get, VERY strong, and strong gears but would be about 700 bucks)


I am pretty comfortable with my front for the time being, because when offroad I am used to being smooth on the throttle with the v8. And unless Im wrong (quite possible) shock loading is what breaks ring and pinions, in which low gears and smooth operation "should" help. The rear however makes me nervous cause as I drive this on the street a bunch too, I can see myself doing something stupid and scattering it all over the road...

Ya know, you always hear about the axle strength of the toy rears, but you never hear about the ring and pinion strength. I wonder how tough it is...

Whatcha think? 

[WHITE_TRASH]

Ive been down that very same road....  My advice, go 9" and don't look back.

[snowplow]

Thanks Trashy

you like the ford 9, or the dana 60 with toy axles?

Whats your setup?

[solar86yota]

I know the Toy 8" rear end is really beefy but for a 351 (c,m or w) I would go with a ford 9" rear because it was designed to deal with that much torque/horsepower from the getgo. As much as I dislike fords and love Toyotas, it still what I would say.

[jimbo74]

in the car/truck industry, most people use 9" over other axles.... my friend runs a 468 chevy in his drag car.... he runs a Strange built 9"

[solar86yota]

Yeah Jimbos right..even alot of the Hardcore GM/Chevy guys run their drag cars with ford 9" rear ends. Their is a Ton of aftermarket centered around them, and alot of the hotrod guys use em' to(My dad had a 36' chevy and Iv'e been to alot of hot rod shows) It seems like the right choice for what you gonna do. Did you ever have any rear end issues with the Yota 8" with the sbf?

[snowplow]

no issues so far- with stock rear axles 4.11 and 4.88, true trac, and 4cyl 3rd.

For the record I would rather run a 9" over a 60 (I kinda think a short 60 would look rediculous - especially with a toy front)

My only thing keeping me from stuffing in a 9" is this: IF my front end dies a nasty death I will upgrade to something else. If I have a 9" rear I think it would be funny running a 60 up front. Currie makes a 9" front which I like but its only rated for 400 hp. If Im spending big money on fronts Im getting BIG . I think it would look kinda backasswards.

I really think it would be a cool setup to run a 9" rear and max beef'd toy front. I actually think it would be a pretty ballanced set up. What do you think?


"I am pretty comfortable with my front for the time being, because when offroad I am used to being smooth on the throttle with the v8. And unless Im wrong (quite possible) shock loading is what breaks ring and pinions, in which low gears and smooth operation "should" help. The rear however makes me nervous cause as I drive this on the street a bunch too, I can see myself doing something stupid and scattering it all over the road...(like burnouts and slamming gears)"

Does this make sense to you guys? Am I thinking right? Im not into hardcore wheeling, just some f'in around. So I could see birfs and axles breaking, but not really the r/p's. However when Im on the road and got an itch to hammer down (on sticky dry pavement) I can see the r/p going BOOM.

How far off am I?

Thanks for the help!

[kneedownnate]

IF you think you'll be updating to a 60 front, I wouldn't hesitate to just swap to a 60 rear now.

[Angler]

I would stick with the Toy Axle. " If " it breaks then go with the ford axle, my friend runs a stock IFS rear 4cly toy axle in his Jeep with a LS1 Corvette motor, with a detroit and 39.5 Iroks and has not had a problem, he is a reguals at tellico and river rock.

[WHITE_TRASH]

I had a extremely healthy 350 in my old 84 and it was ridiculous how often it was busted... The only factory yota part I never managed to break was the steering box and the t-case.  When I sold it it has #'s 11 and 12 3rd member in it respectively.  I couldn't keep diffs in it to save my arse...  I blew everything from 3.90's to 4.88's  So as I said, drop in a 9" and don't worry about it.

[94MtnYote]

  Hate to say it but 9'' would be sweet and depending on the lug pattern you could run 8.8 disc brakes.

[snowplow]

Thanks all - good advice!  I think what I do with my front end will decide this for me. If I leave the toy front and you all think it will hold up, then Ill go 9" rear. If My front is going to pop, then Ill do a 60 rear now and maybe a 60 front later so they match. But I really dont want 60's cause their huge heavy and a pain in the arse.

Here is what is done to my front. Let me know if you think she has a fighting chance. (like I said Im nowhere near the desert and go fast places, and I dont have many rocks to play on either, just wet washington)

My front:

Toy 8" HP with electric locker, 79 housing fully trussed, shaved, and boxed, with knuckle ball gussets, 4.88 now- probably 4.11 future, 30 sp longfield super set (inners + outers)

whatcha think? 

[Thomas P]

send your r&p to bobby long and have them cryo'ed and also look into a 5th stud for your steering, you can make it homemade cheap and easy, and then your toy axle will be fully beefed up

[DTB]

send your r&p to bobby long and have them cryo'ed and also look into a 5th stud for your steering, you can make it homemade cheap and easy, and then your toy axle will be fully beefed up

bobby also sells 5th stud modifications if you are lazy

[Hammerhead]

I noticed a few "Choice Rearends" over in the GBG thread... 

[Kaptain]

If you are running that kind of power you might as well ditch the toy axles all together.  The 3rd's are just not going to hold up. 

The ford 9" is not much of an upgrade  IMO - I would step up and do a Dana 60 front and 14 bolt rear.  Very cheap and STRONG.  There's tons of info on Pirate as this is one of the most common swaps when you have that kind of horsepower and torque.

[snowplow]

Not that cheap to shorten!

A early bronco rear 9" will be 1/2" narrower. I figure I could run the front toy for a while and maybe upgrade to this front:

http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/ProductsRE.aspx?id=1554

Pretty big money if I do that front, but I think I would have a million options and never really want anything else. I dont think I could break it. Plus quite a bit smaller and lighter than a 60 or 14.

I think two 9s in a yota would be the cats meow. I would do 60's if I wanted to go fullsize but not yet!

am I dumb?

[Yoat Goat]

D60 rears suck, fronts are money but not rears. Seen, heard of alot of them snap axles where the toyota axles and others have held up fine. If your truck still had the toyota motor i'd say leave the toys axles in. But you've tripled the power and torque(stockish V8) and added bigger tires. I am all about toyotas, I dont think I'll ever swap them out BUT a 609 in the front and a 9 in the back would be awesome. Strong, and fairly cheap, pretty badass setup...

[bigarms23]

run a spydertrax 609 and design it to the length you need

[snowplow]

run a spydertrax 609 and design it to the length you need

wow..... I think Im in love! This is perfectly what I wanted. Can you get 35sp inner axles?

[Hammerhead]

I'm running a SBC 350, SM465, FJ40 2.3 T-case, and Cruiser 9.5" diffs on 38.5s and the only things I've broken were old coarse spline pinions and birfields.  Depending on how you drive you might get away with running a similar set-up. 

On the other hand there are people who can screw up an anvil in the middle of the desert barehanded.  I have a friend like that who can't keep a D60 alive under his sammi with a stock motor... 


That being said if you have the money and don't even want to think about your axles then customs are the way to go. 

[bigarms23]

yeah you can get 35spline shafts or thoses dynatrac 40splines might fit as well