Author Topic: Long-wheelbase rigs...WTF??? (Read 2869 times)

Duffil · « **on:** Jun 04, 2006, 02:33:52 PM »

I don't get it...isn't the consensus that longer-wheelbase rigs (think X-Tra cab Toy) wheel better than SWB ones? I just got back from running an easy trail with my truck, and that thing rides like a brick.

My old singlecab 84 went on the same trail, with much better success. I do realize my old rig had 4.88s, and this thing is still 4.10, but gearing didn't seem to be a problem. The front springs on the old rig were so flat, the shackle rested against the frame(there was no compression travel). This one ain't like that; the axle can actually travel(hehe, I ripped off a mudflap...) Maybe it rode like poo because the torque rod is still connected? Maybe I just had too high of expectations for this pile?? So, what am I missing? Anyone got any ideas?

Hyena · « **Reply #1 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 02:38:19 PM »

I don't know, my extra cab will go pretty much wherever i want it too.

jimbo74 · « **Reply #2 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 02:41:33 PM »

it depends on the situation, sometimes lwb is better, sometimes it isnt....

DTB · « **Reply #3 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 02:42:07 PM »

They both have distinct advantages and disadvantages. I'm too lazy to list most of them but there are other factors as well besides the obvious (departure and approach angles, stability, breakover angle, which lines are chosen, driving style, turning radius trail conditions, etc. Think of how a SWB Jeep or zuki can climb a short pointed hill but my extracab will high-center no doubt! But I can take my xtra cab up or down more extreme, long hills and not worry about about a stinger or going end over end. So, to summarize, I would say SWB major advantage is turning radius and breakover angle......LWB is stability

Duffil · « **Reply #4 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 04:42:44 PM »

Maybe it's just me. $I\'m Down$ Maybe I'm too worried about hurting this one, and I held back.

Lady Di · « **Reply #5 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 05:09:57 PM »

We stretched the Mammoth 25" for a reason, but we are still probably only about equal with a SWB yota now. (right around 100" I think)
Definitly better stability, but you do loose the turning radius. There is a compromise in everything.

79coyotefrg · « **Reply #6 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 06:18:22 PM »

sounds like the springs are a bit stiff

Rocksurfer · « **Reply #7 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 06:36:05 PM »

What couldn't you do that you used to, as for the ride they have the same springs as the swb unless somebody tossed in add a leafs which will make the suspension hard or brick like.

Duffil · « **Reply #8 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 07:34:37 PM »

Quote from: 79Coyotefrg on Jun 04, 2006, 06:18:22 PM

sounds like the springs are a bit stiff

the springs are stock, all the way around.

Duffil · « **Reply #9 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 07:39:34 PM »

Quote from: Rocksurfer on Jun 04, 2006, 06:36:05 PM

What couldn't you do that you used to, as for the ride they have the same springs as the swb unless somebody tossed in add a leafs which will make the suspension hard or brick like.

Well, last time i went up there, I was able to walk through the trail. This time I felt like I was fighting the truck to go where I needed to. Both trucks are/were open diffs, exact same tires are on this truck. I just can't figger it. There's no AALs in the packs, RS, they are stock.

As far as I can remember, the only difference between the two rigs was
1)torque arm is still on this truck
2) old truck had flat-as-hell-and-it-sat-level-with-them-on 3" ProComp front springs. This shouldn't be a factor, B/C the old truck had no compression travel, but this one does.
3) wheelbase

Rocksurfer · « **Reply #10 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 08:28:35 PM »

Hmmm go figure, my lwb truck is much less than any other rig I've owned setup wise and does very well because of longer wheel base and I still have the torque rod on my front.

Ramrod · « **Reply #11 on:** Jun 04, 2006, 10:58:31 PM »

it seems like there is never a perfect wheelbase but up at the rubicon it seems like the longer trucks do a little better and down at the hammers the shorter ones do better. But there are still spots where I easily went in my shortbed reg cab where hyena got stuck with his ex-cab and then the other way. but I still like my short wheelbase way better

sloyota · « **Reply #12 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 08:32:26 AM »

Quote from: Hyena on Jun 04, 2006, 02:38:19 PM

I don't know, my extra cab will go pretty much wherever i want it too.

same here..

MiniSimp · « **Reply #13 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 08:47:22 AM »

I had a 137" WB truck and now a 106" WB truck, and I'm loving the SWB a lot better!

Lady Di · « **Reply #14 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 10:34:07 AM »

so even with our longer WB we still have a short WB by comparison.

blackdiamond · « **Reply #15 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 12:23:16 PM »

Long wheelbase rigs often do better climbing because the front and rear tires do not have to climb at the same time. Examples would be Dump Bump, Widow Maker and Double Whammy in Moab. You can drive a fairly stock full size truck up Dump Bump and Double Whammy, but most short wheelbase rigs have great difficulty.

Short wheelbase are generally better for maneuverability in tight spots.

In my opinion, as long as the rig will fit, longer is better, but opinions are only opinions.

No matter what the wheelbase, you will find a place that has rocks or ledges spaced perfectly to make you look like a monkey. When I had the Truetrac in the front there was one spot on the Moab Rim that always gave me fits, but the Aussie solved the problem completely.

jimbo74 · « **Reply #16 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 12:26:38 PM »

when i went wheeling years ago on a ford explorer run, we encountered a trail called jeep hill, the jeeps basically all got stuck going up the hill because of where the ruts were, none of our groups explorers had any problems, because the explorers had a slightly longer wheelbase, but around the same width

blackdiamond · « **Reply #17 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 12:29:35 PM »

Quote from: Captain4x2 on Jun 05, 2006, 12:26:38 PM

when i went wheeling years ago on a ford explorer run, we encountered a trail called jeep hill, the jeeps basically all got stuck going up the hill because of where the ruts were, none of our groups explorers had any problems, because the explorers had a slightly longer wheelbase, but around the same width

I think this is a common problem for Jeeps. The reason isn't because they are Jeeps, but since the majority of the 4x4 rigs in the world are Jeeps often times all of the holes and ruts in the trails hang them up when having a slightly different wheelbase or track width makes all the difference. The hole and ruts are the result of spinning tires with open differentials.

Rocksurfer · « **Reply #18 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 01:54:21 PM »

Since I've wheeled just about everything out there, you also have to remember that there is a learning curve on how a vehicle reacts on the trail. I can throw my lwb truck on angles that I'd have not put my 4Runner on. Then on that learning curve I found a boulder that I usually missed in my swb truck. Smacked that bumper pretty hard. It's hard to tell what is occuring without being there and seeing what the truck is doing, and why it doesn't wheel as your past rig. Since you had no compression on your swb you would have had no bump-steer, maybe you have some bump-steer in this truck since you now have travel.

DTB · « **Reply #19 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 02:21:04 PM »

Quote from: blackdiamond on Jun 05, 2006, 12:23:16 PM

Long wheelbase rigs often do better climbing because the front and rear tires do not have to climb at the same time. Examples would be Dump Bump, Widow Maker and Double Whammy in Moab. You can drive a fairly stock full size truck up Dump Bump and Double Whammy, but most short wheelbase rigs have great difficulty.

Short wheelbase are generally better for maneuverability in tight spots.

In my opinion, as long as the rig will fit, longer is better, but opinions are only opinions.

No matter what the wheelbase, you will find a place that has rocks or ledges spaced perfectly to make you look like a monkey. When I had the Truetrac in the front there was one spot on the Moab Rim that always gave me fits, but the Aussie solved the problem completely.

That's what I was trying to think of but couldn't for some reason. A lot of it has to do with where your tires hit a rock, ledge, root, or whatever on a given obstacle. This placement of course is different for short and long wheel base. This can be the difference between getting thru the obstacle/trail.

or not

Duffil · « **Reply #20 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 10:36:33 PM »

I know what you're all saying, and I tried to go into this with that understanding. It kinda proves to me that I don't yet know this rig as well as my last, and I've got some work to do. I guess I'm just gonna have to throw some springs under this thing and give it another shot. Looks like I need to get off the street more often.

Ramrod · « **Reply #21 on:** Jun 05, 2006, 10:58:54 PM »

alot of it is based on your tire size also. I think my ideal would be at about 109" right now its 106 but it seems a little longer would help but i might make it a little longer I dont know

4inchToyotas · « **Reply #22 on:** Jun 06, 2006, 09:23:50 AM »

trails change over time, at least out here they do. If it's all rock then it's not going to change that much. It's kinda like what we experience at Tellico: On dry days the hardest trails are impossible (or near to it) let it rain the night before and during the day and they're much easier, just the nature to the beast I guess.

Duffil · « **Reply #23 on:** Jun 06, 2006, 01:44:57 PM »

Quote from: 4inchT100 on Jun 06, 2006, 09:23:50 AM

trails change over time, at least out here they do. If it's all rock then it's not going to change that much. It's kinda like what we experience at Tellico: On dry days the hardest trails are impossible (or near to it) let it rain the night before and during the day and they're much easier, just the nature to the beast I guess.

The trail in question was mostly rock. It is pretty much the same.

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