Author Topic: 22R and White smoke.  (Read 2426 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

E120ER

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
22R and White smoke.
« on: Mar 22, 2018, 07:06:45 PM »
My question is in regards to the intake manifold gasket on a 1981 22R California edition engine. The engine has 165K miles on it and runs strong, no lag in power or hesitations of any kind. The coolant is always full and no leaks have been detected on either the block, timing cover or head gasket. The oil is clean and free of any coolant.  The cylinder compression was tested and they were all reading at 160psi, +/- 2psi. The other morning, I noticed a cloud of white smoke coming from the exhaust during the engine warm up and initial drive. My initial though was that the head gasket was going bad. Though with the above observations mentioned I was wondering how possible is it for the intake manifold gasket to fail resulting in coolant to enter the combustion chamber? I pulled the plugs and only cylinder, number two show signs of being clean, i.e. steam cleaning from the coolant. Is this possible or should I concede that my head gasket is blown? I'm sorry I can not post a picture of the plugs yet since I have just joined.

EASYRYDERDANGER

  • Offline Rock Master
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 1771
  • Male Posts: 210
  • Member since Jul '06
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #1 on: Mar 22, 2018, 09:19:34 PM »
So you think you are burning coolant from an internal leak, you are confident you have zero external leaks. Therefore, you can monitor your coolant level and see if it drops.  If the level does not drop and/or the frequency of "white smoke" is not consistent this concern may have to get worse before you accurately diagnose it.  But to answer your main question on an intake manifold leak, sure, I'd suppose it's possible for the gasket material between intake ports and the coolant ports to fail.  I don't 100% know the construction of the 22r lower intake but I would doubt the casting would crack. Either of the two sound like a long shot, but these rigs are old and anything is possible.  That's my 2 cents, Canadian currency value of course.

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #2 on: Mar 23, 2018, 02:59:02 AM »
So you think you are burning coolant from an internal leak...

I agree.  Head gasket failure would be my guess.  :sad2:

Gnarls. :inthedark:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Lewis Hein

  • Shoutbox Ban
  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 245
  • Posts: 463
  • Member since Feb '17
  • Trying to equal the wonderful one-hoss shay
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #3 on: Mar 23, 2018, 06:04:09 AM »
In my time, I've seen exactly 1 failed head gasket, not on a 22R, so take the following with a grain of salt.

The gasket was letting coolant into the oil and into the cylinders, so I got the classic chocolate milkshake oil. Plus, the vehicle would have to crank and crank to start, and then would run on only 1 or two cylinders until the moisture got blown out of the other two.

I would say, replace that head gasket with a toyota MLS one and see if the problem goes away. If so, you have solved it; if not (and if you did the HG replacement right) you have peace of mind about your HG for a good, long, while.

Just my two cents. Hope it's useful.

Edit: The Toyota gasket may not be MLS after all (Thanks, EASYRYDERDANGER), but it's still widely reputed to be made of some kind of better stuff than the aftermarket ones.

emsvitil

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 5556
  • Male Posts: 3,409
  • Member since May '07
    • View Profile
    • emsvitil's album
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #4 on: Mar 23, 2018, 02:52:55 PM »
A head gasket leak will usually be both ways.

Air will be forced into the cooling system.

Ed
SoCal
86 SR5 XtraCab
22RE  W56B
31x10.50R15

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #5 on: Mar 24, 2018, 12:04:28 PM »
 The engine starts on the first crank and runs strong. The oil has not changed color nor a noticeable drop in coolant level yet.  The only reason for leaning towards a failure in the intake manifold gasket is that the engine only has 165k miles on it and runs well. Also it's much easier to change the intake manifold gasket.  I'm at a loss,  but I do know coolant is entering three combustion chamber because the number two plug is steam cleaned. I do appreciate them help.

OVRAROK

  • Online The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 22516
  • Male Posts: 2,745
  • Member since Dec '10
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #6 on: Mar 24, 2018, 12:08:10 PM »
Valve stem seal  :dunno:, have you done a leak down test?
Even the most primitive society, has an intimate respect for the insane.

EASYRYDERDANGER

  • Offline Rock Master
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 1771
  • Male Posts: 210
  • Member since Jul '06
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #7 on: Mar 24, 2018, 12:30:10 PM »
warm up the engine, turn off engine, pull all 4 spark plugs, put cooling system pressure tester on and pressurize for 4hrs or more while checking and making sure it stay pressurized every hr or so.  Then look through spark plug hole with boroscope to see if coolant is in cylinder

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #8 on: Mar 24, 2018, 01:21:09 PM »
I have not done a leak down test yet,  that's next on the list. A valve stem seal could be bad also,  I have not written that off yet either. I'm going to buy a radiator coolant pressure kit from Harbor Freight to try that test mentioned from the poster above. When I get a few more posts I will upload images of the smoke from the exhaust I get during the initial start up and the conditions of the spark plugs.

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #9 on: Mar 24, 2018, 02:40:08 PM »
warm up the engine, turn off engine, pull all 4 spark plugs, put cooling system pressure tester on and pressurize for 4hrs or more while checking and making sure it stay pressurized every hr or so.  Then look through spark plug hole with boroscope to see if coolant is in cylinder

Or.. just pull the head.  Heads and head gaskets fail at 165K miles.  :thumbdown:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #10 on: Mar 24, 2018, 02:40:55 PM »
probably doesn't apply in your case since you have a steam cleaned plug but full synthetic oil will burn white also

What???????? :dunno:

Gnarls. :gap:
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #11 on: Mar 24, 2018, 02:52:17 PM »
I'm running Castrol 10W-40. Unfortunately I'm unable to post a picture,  because I'm not able to reduce a image below the max of 140kb.

OVRAROK

  • Online The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 22516
  • Male Posts: 2,745
  • Member since Dec '10
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #12 on: Mar 24, 2018, 03:06:47 PM »
I'm running Castrol 10W-40. Unfortunately I'm unable to post a picture,  because I'm not able to reduce a image below the max of 140kb.

Try posting on tapatalk, works great for me
Even the most primitive society, has an intimate respect for the insane.

emsvitil

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 5556
  • Male Posts: 3,409
  • Member since May '07
    • View Profile
    • emsvitil's album
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #13 on: Mar 24, 2018, 03:08:37 PM »
Or.. just pull the head.  Heads and head gaskets fail at 165K miles.  :thumbdown:

What

You mean my head gasket has failed and I didn't know about it


 :dunno:
Ed
SoCal
86 SR5 XtraCab
22RE  W56B
31x10.50R15

EASYRYDERDANGER

  • Offline Rock Master
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 1771
  • Male Posts: 210
  • Member since Jul '06
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #14 on: Mar 24, 2018, 06:35:05 PM »
Or.. just pull the head.  Heads and head gaskets fail at 165K miles.  :thumbdown:
I gave him the true way to diagnose it, but sure, fire the parts cannon.  Im sure there is a mileage interval for head gasket from the factory, lol

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #15 on: Mar 24, 2018, 10:15:47 PM »
Bottom line is that I'm disappointed that potentially the head or intake gasket has failed.  Granted the truck is thirty six years old with only 165k miles on it.

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #16 on: Mar 25, 2018, 05:44:26 AM »
synthetic oil has a white/gray smoke when burned in the combustion chamber, conventional oil burns blue. that's been my experience. point is, white smoke doesn't always mean coolant



Interesting.... I guess the old saying.. "You learn something new every day" applies here.

Until now I have NEVER heard or read that synthetic motor, when burned in an engine, makes white smoke out the exhaust.  I've used full synthetic motor oil for over 30 years (from mid 80's) in 14 Toyotas, 6 Chevys, Honda, Datsun, VW, and Mercedes... and NEVER saw any white smoke because I was using full synthetic motor oil?  :dunno:

I've watched a zillion hours of all kinds of auto racing and motor sports... when I saw white smoke from the exhaust from a blown engine using full synthetic motor oil I thought it was from the coolant?  :dunno:

Gnarls.  :disturbed:


« Last Edit: Mar 25, 2018, 06:43:21 AM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #17 on: Mar 25, 2018, 06:11:56 AM »
... A valve stem seal could be bad also,  I have not written that off yet either. 

How does a leaking valve guide seal make white smoke?  :dunno:

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #18 on: Mar 25, 2018, 06:13:43 AM »
... When I get a few more posts I will upload images of the smoke from the exhaust I get during the initial start up and the conditions of the spark plugs.

Can you use https://imgur.com/   ?

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #19 on: Mar 25, 2018, 06:16:51 AM »
... I'm going to buy a radiator coolant pressure kit from Harbor Freight ...

You might consider going to a local Autozone or parts store and getting a loaner or rental coolant system pressure tester.

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

EASYRYDERDANGER

  • Offline Rock Master
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 1771
  • Male Posts: 210
  • Member since Jul '06
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #20 on: Mar 25, 2018, 06:43:53 AM »
And the best part is once you are done with it for your truck it has a million other uses.  You can look up your nose, up your butt, down your throat, in your ear, I all your friends/family orifices.  Great fun! Under bathroom stall doors. Pretend to be in a swat movie.  https://www.walmart.com/ip/Waterproof-HD-2M-7mm-Endoscope-Lens-Mini-USB-Inspection-Camera-with-6-LED-Lights-Borescope-for-Android-Smartphone-PC-Laptop/924102324?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=9869&adid=22222222228083850308&wmlspartner=wmtlabs&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=196367365898&wl4=pla-314984353131&wl5=9033270&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=115780161&wl11=online&wl12=924102324&wl13=&veh=sem

Gnarly4X

  • Online Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3814
  • Male Posts: 3,191
  • Member since Jun '16
  • Marlin and I slid "The Sluice" Martinez Canyon
    • View Profile
    • Buy me some coffee
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #21 on: Mar 25, 2018, 07:20:39 AM »
If the "white smoke' is really smoke from burning synthetic oil and not water vapor and coolant it should be really easy to tell the difference.  :gap:

Gnarls.
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header. https://imgur.com/oACTHTR

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #22 on: Mar 25, 2018, 09:03:42 AM »
Toyota factory gaskets and other parts are on the way to my house. Looks like I have quite a project ahead of me in the coming weeks. My other two Toyotas are over 17l0k miles and have no signs of slowing down. I'm guessing are caused this gasket to fail.

E120ER [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 19
  • Member since Mar '17
  • Crawling with Marlin
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #23 on: Mar 25, 2018, 01:00:21 PM »
Any thoughts on water bypass gasket on the bottom of the intake going bad and leaking into the intake? This was mentioned by another poster?

Snowtoy

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 726
  • Male Posts: 2,389
  • Member since Sep '03
    • View Profile
Re: 22R and White smoke.
« Reply #24 on: Mar 25, 2018, 03:25:24 PM »
Easy enough to tell if you are burning coolant, it well smell sweet.
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

 
 
 
 
 

Related Topics

Tire smoke
36 Replies
6391 Views
Last post Jan 12, 2006, 04:02:11 PM
by rockscrambler
4 Replies
1354 Views
Last post Apr 03, 2006, 08:08:14 PM
by 79coyotefrg
22 Replies
9363 Views
Last post Nov 29, 2006, 03:31:54 PM
by madhunt
14 Replies
2091 Views
Last post Apr 11, 2007, 02:00:54 PM
by Tallchevy
1 Replies
1186 Views
Last post Jan 15, 2009, 09:05:46 AM
by Toymin8r