Topic: rear overload leaf

[birfection]

I'm running stock rear leafs in my 1980 pickup. i am replacing the bushings and wondering if I should remove the bottom(overload?) leaf from the pack. I don't haul a lot of weight, and i am building a flatbed for the truck. I want the rear to flex more, but i also don't want the rear to hop like crazy in sand.(axle wrap) What should i do?

[Quick Draw]

Yeah you can take it out.  Especially if you're planning on a light flatbed.  But you will definitely get more axle wrap.  Two options to cure that:  1. Traction bar  2. anti-wrap (half) leaf.

[emsvitil]

The overload spring is the only thing hold up my rear from sagging too much............

(no gap anymore, even when bed is empty)

[birfection [OP]]

Yeah you can take it out.  Especially if you're planning on a light flatbed.  But you will definitely get more axle wrap.  Two options to cure that:  1. Traction bar  2. anti-wrap (half) leaf.

Sounds like i should keep the overloads in. The ride might be stiffer, but that's better than a ton of axle wrap. Here's a question: If i decide to run a traction bar, will it make a difference if i run the springs with or without the overload leaf?

[85_4RNR]

Axle hop is what you mean. You don't have bad axle wrap. I have more wrap now with my overloads out but never had hop. I think hop is just an inescapable pickup thing. Axle wrap is when your axle twists when you accelerate hard.

[birfection [OP]]

Axle hop is what you mean. You don't have bad axle wrap. I have more wrap now with my overloads out but never had hop. I think hop is just an inescapable pickup thing. Axle wrap is when your axle twists when you accelerate hard.

Yes, i am referring to rear hopping. Can a 22r really cause that much axle wrap anyway? And will taking the overload out cause the truck to hop more? (I'm running 33s)

[Quick Draw]

Axle hop is what you mean. You don't have bad axle wrap. I have more wrap now with my overloads out but never had hop. I think hop is just an inescapable pickup thing. Axle wrap is when your axle twists when you accelerate hard.

Axle hop is created by axle wrap.  The torque of the axle is transferred to the leaf springs, where they rapidly load up and release the energy (hop).  So if he has bad axle hop, yes he has axle wrap.  Your truck probably just has bent leaves, so it won't hop when it wraps anymore.  My old Tacoma used to be able to bend brand new leaves in a month with axle wrap.  When it stopped bouncing so hard when I was drag racing somebody, then I knew they were done for.  Axle hop is not an inescapable pickup thing.  It's just a crappy leaf spring setup thing.

Birfection, with the traction bar the hop should be limited, so you can set up a nice soft spring rate without the consequences.  The drawback of a traction bar is that its yet another thing hanging down to hang your truck up on.  However, I have seen some that were done very well and tucked up nice.

An anti-wrap leaf is a leaf cut in half, that is placed at the top of the pack facing the front.  This resists the wave motion of the springs when they wrap.  This will likely stiffen the suspension some, but not as much as a full leaf.  The drawback of this is that you can still get axle hop with enough torque.  It's just a limiter.

The fool-proof method to get a nice soft spring rate with no wrap whatsoever is to chop off the leaf springs, and do a link suspension.

Can a 22R axle wrap?  Oh yeah..  Wait until you're hung up on something, then you will really see it happen.  My 20R can wrap up the springs just taking off from a light quickly.  Granted it doesn't do it nearly as bad as my old Tacoma did.  

But really, you should just try it.  It doesn't take too much time, and it (shouldn't) cost you anything.  I'm running stock Tacoma leaf springs with the overload pulled, and the axle wrap isn't enough to bother me.  I have a flat bed, but it's probably about the same weight as the stock bed or more.  Eventually I will 4-link it, but for now it's fine.

[85_4RNR]

Hmmmmm. I have zero axle hop but terrible axle wrap. Every pickup truck Ive wheeled with has terrible axle hop, even new trucks. Ive never seen an SUV or owned one that has had axle hop.

My land cruiser-- no axle hop
my 93 pickup---hopped a lot
current 85 4runner---no axle hop at all
dads 00 taco--bad axle hop
friends 85 pickup--bad axle hop

 
And were refering to axle hop that happens when your spinnin tires in deep sand and it feels like your truck is gonna fall apart due to the intense vibrations.

sorry for the hijack bro

Im a little confused

[79coyotefrg]

leave the flat leaf in the pack

[Quick Draw]

85_4RNR, it's probably just a difference in weight over the rear axle.  No doubt a light back end will hop more.  But anything with leaf springs is capable of hopping.  I have seen a 2nd gen Runner with Chevys (which is a heavy biatch compared to your 1st gen), hop in particular wheeling situations.

[85_4RNR]

Ok.  8)  I always thought that might have something to do with it.

[birfection [OP]]

Alright, so I'm not in a position to get different springs or a traction bar at this time. I'm building a fairly light flatbed for my truck. To achieve the best traction(less hop) in snow and sand, should i leave the overload leaf in the stock pack or remove it?

[Quick Draw]

Leave it in if traction is your priority.  If a smoother ride is your priority, pull it out.

[kneedownnate]

Every pickup truck Ive wheeled with has terrible axle hop, even new trucks.

Remember the commercials ford ran a couple years back with a mustang romping around in a big empty warehouse with a wet floor?  Remember the quick shot of it burning off the tires while taking off?  Remember the tire hopping repeatedly 

My first gen has horrible axle wrap, which leads to horrible hop, which sucked even worse when it had more power. 

[OOPS]

Another solution would be to put an anti-wrap leaf on top of the spring pack. Not that hard to do.

[emsvitil]

could i cut my overload in half and use it as the anti-wrap leaf on top?

It's too flat, and would tend to lower the rear

[birfection [OP]]

What works good as an anti-wrap leaf? Where would i find one?

[Quick Draw]

Go to a junk yard and get a Toyota leaf pack you can cut up.  Use a leaf from the pack that's fairly long.  But as I said earlier, this anti-wrap leaf doesn't necessarily get rid of axle wrap.  It just resists and limits it.