Author Topic: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s  (Read 8845 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

jrock

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« on: Aug 03, 2008, 03:01:10 PM »
I am rebuilding my front axle and was wondering what I should do with the Trunion bearings. The FSM recommends using a tool to measure for the correct shims. Since I am replacing them and there races I thought this would have to be done. Is there a DIY tool I could build or where, and how much, could I find the actual tool? Do I need to do this?
Thanks. :beerchug:

Duffil

  • *lurker*
  • Offline Gold Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 88
  • Male Posts: 4,832
  • Member since Nov '04
  • -Hack-
    • View Profile
    • PhotoBucket
    • Buy me a soda
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #1 on: Aug 03, 2008, 07:57:01 PM »
start with 1 thick and 1 thin shim, and go from there.

or just put the old ones back on.

KDXSR5

  • Poser Shot Extraordinaire
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 61
  • Male Posts: 2,812
  • Member since Dec '06
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #2 on: Aug 03, 2008, 08:07:57 PM »
I have done the one thick, one thin on both the top and the bottom of both sides, and it pulled at the higher end of the acceptable scale, about 13ish if I remember correctly. OOPS has explained it all to me before, maybe PM him if you need better answers.

OOPS

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 830
  • Male Posts: 2,542
  • Member since May '02
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #3 on: Aug 03, 2008, 08:31:33 PM »
The bottom shims are how the knuckle is centered, the top ones are how the pre-load is set. Do what Duffil said as far as the bottom ones.

This place use to sell the SST but I could not find it. I even put in the PN and it did not come up. PN is 09606-60020 so they may not be making them anymore

http://toyota.spx.com/index.aspx

Your best bet is to get the "Super Seals" from Marlin. They are a lot more forgiving then the stock axle seals and well worth the extra cost.

David & Theresa Fritzsche, 1990 Ex-Cab with a few mods!!!!!!!!! Roseville, CA Sobriety =Serenity

OOPS

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 830
  • Male Posts: 2,542
  • Member since May '02
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #4 on: Aug 03, 2008, 08:41:24 PM »
Here is a great writeup on rebuilding the axle written in laymans terms.

http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/AxleRebuild.shtml
David & Theresa Fritzsche, 1990 Ex-Cab with a few mods!!!!!!!!! Roseville, CA Sobriety =Serenity

jrock [OP]

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #5 on: Aug 03, 2008, 10:37:17 PM »
"When reinstalling the steering arms and lower knuckle bearing retainers, be sure to install the appropriate shims.
I think mine were bone stock when I took them apart and there were no shims.
The rebuild kit came with a huge stack of shims. I at first put the knuckle back together w/o shims and found it was overly tight.
After asking around, the consensus seems to say 0.40mm (or 0.040" I don't know what units are used ) of shims is the right amount.
The factory manual describes a bearing drag measurement technique if you prefer:
Use a fish scale to pull on the steering arm until the break-free pull is 7-13 lbs.
Do this without the knuckle wiper seals installed, just the knuckle bearings.
Be sure to pack the knuckle bearings before installing them."

This says nothing about centering the knuckle.

And this came up for 09696-60020.
http://toyota.spx.com/detail.aspx?id=355

OOPS

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 830
  • Male Posts: 2,542
  • Member since May '02
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #6 on: Aug 03, 2008, 11:24:54 PM »
If you have the FSM, the real one from Toyota it talks about centering the knuckle.

If you notice when you bring up the PN there is a dash 01 after the 09696-60020. That is a different SST.

This is what the 09696-60020 looks like. I made this one on my lathe using the factory SST for measurements. The person that I borrowed it from bought it from the web page I posted.

The person that I learned to set these front ends up is a 30 year Toyota tech who is now the Foreman at the Roseville dealership.

David & Theresa Fritzsche, 1990 Ex-Cab with a few mods!!!!!!!!! Roseville, CA Sobriety =Serenity

jrock [OP]

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #7 on: Aug 04, 2008, 09:40:47 AM »
Okay, that's the tool I was thinking of. So my question is, do I need to use that to center the knuckle? Do I center the knuckle or do I wing it?

KDXSR5

  • Poser Shot Extraordinaire
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 61
  • Male Posts: 2,812
  • Member since Dec '06
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #8 on: Aug 04, 2008, 10:31:28 AM »
If using the Marlin Super Seals like I did, centering is no where near as critical as it was with just regular seals. Buy the Marlin seals and don't worry about centering it. :twocents:

jrock [OP]

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #9 on: Aug 04, 2008, 10:35:12 AM »
I bought a kit from someone who said it is a Marlin kit but I can't tell.

KDXSR5

  • Poser Shot Extraordinaire
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 61
  • Male Posts: 2,812
  • Member since Dec '06
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #10 on: Aug 04, 2008, 10:53:30 AM »
I would suggest just buying the seals, because my Marlin kit did not come with the Marlin HD seals, I had to order the HD seals (MC-12149) seperately.



OOPS

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 830
  • Male Posts: 2,542
  • Member since May '02
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #11 on: Aug 04, 2008, 08:17:23 PM »
The Super Seals do not come with the rebuild kit you have to buy them separate.

As far a centering I would do what Duffil said, one thin one thick. I find it hard to believe that that axle has never been torn apart. I have torn apart at least twenty of them and they all had shims on the bottom trunion caps.
David & Theresa Fritzsche, 1990 Ex-Cab with a few mods!!!!!!!!! Roseville, CA Sobriety =Serenity

jrock [OP]

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #12 on: Aug 04, 2008, 10:22:25 PM »
My axle is in horrible shape, leaks like a sieve. I thought the seals you were talking about were the knuckle wipers. I will buy a set of those HD seals though.
Taking apart this axle will be a first for me so I expect it all to be stock. I will go from there.

As far as tips... any for a newb?

KDXSR5

  • Poser Shot Extraordinaire
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 61
  • Male Posts: 2,812
  • Member since Dec '06
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #13 on: Aug 04, 2008, 11:49:40 PM »
Clean. Clean everything. Before i rebuilt mine it would leave puddles of gear oil and grease because it leaked so badly. Now it doesn't leak at all. Cleaning stuff well makes just about anything easier.

Do one side at a time so if you get completely lost you can take apart the other side to see how it is supposed to work.

If you take the hub dial assembly apart, don't loose the little tiny ball bearing like I did the first time.

Umm... don't over torque anything like I did and break bolts off.

Also, on both sides of my axle, the top caliper bolt was stripped, so I did not torque them down to spec when I put it back together, I just tightened it until I felt it was about to brake loose.

Study everything on the subject you can before doing it. I read a few articles on line about it, and I read my FSM about a dozen times before tackling it.

Other than that, the only real advice I have is make sure you get those Marlin HD front axle seals.

DTB

  • Shoutbox Moderator
  • Offline Gold Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 2
  • Male Posts: 7,117
  • Member since Nov '05
  • Squirrels and beer don't mix
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #14 on: Aug 05, 2008, 05:30:47 AM »
read these

http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/AxleRebuild.shtml

http://www.birfield.com/~morgan/tech/axle/index.html

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/maintenance/front_end/solid_axle/

familiarize yourself with the process before you start. If you are doing a full rebuild make sure you use STOCK OEM bearings!
RIP KYOTA
Quote
toyminator2000 There has to be dumb people in order for there to be smart people
Low down & durrrrrrty Rock Stacking Web Wheeler :driving: Too many Yuppies..:shake:...Not enough Hippies :flamer:  Hobbies: stealing cookies, slangin' tacos, owning tequila bars, wheeling with paco

Wermz84

  • Rock Nerd!
  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 921
  • Male Posts: 3,518
  • Member since May '05
  • Ouch My Eye!
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #15 on: Aug 05, 2008, 09:45:22 AM »
Well Crap.  I was going to buy the tool right after the round up to re do my front end.  Just tryied calling them and that was pointless.

Maybee I can sweet talk my local toyota parts guy into selling me one SST.  :yesnod:
I like to Drive!

OOPS

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline The 2.5K Group
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 830
  • Male Posts: 2,542
  • Member since May '02
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #16 on: Aug 05, 2008, 10:35:59 PM »
I am going to throw this out and it is my opinion. Do not buy the kit from Trail Gear, the trunion bearings that come with there are no-name bearings made in China. I broke one on a wheeling trip before I got to the trail and it wiped out a 30-spline Long. I was lucky and Bobby replaced it for free. When I asked them about they told me my front-end was set-up wrong and I was the first one to every break one. They offered to send me a new kit free and I told the to keep the POS.
David & Theresa Fritzsche, 1990 Ex-Cab with a few mods!!!!!!!!! Roseville, CA Sobriety =Serenity

jrock [OP]

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 77
  • Male Posts: 3,395
  • Member since Oct '06
  • Oodelally
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #17 on: Aug 05, 2008, 10:58:46 PM »
I have done quite a bit of reading now and I feel comfortable doing this job. But I still need the tools.... haha, if it isn't one thing, it's another. Tools, space, time, $$.... Oh and now I need to order the HD seals. This might take a bit longer.

hilux-1983

  • Offline The 1K Club
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 3
  • Male Posts: 1,271
  • Member since Apr '09
    • View Profile
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2010, 11:36:28 PM »
Nice article, old I know but, still a lot of good info....
DD, 22R, L52HD, 35"s, All pro/Marlin Hysteer, 529's, Aussie Locker in rear only. 5" All Pro springs and 5" shackles. Just purpose built and dependable. A/C blows like ice too... www.4x4HIM.org

79coyotefrg

  • Rock Ninja
  • Offline Gold Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 1420
  • Male Posts: 22,622
  • Member since May '02
  • Solid axle Toys Rule ! ! !
    • View Profile
    • HotSprings Superlift ORV park
Re: Front axle rebuilding Q?'s
« Reply #19 on: Mar 29, 2012, 09:15:24 PM »
I wanted to save a few pictures here since I was looking for this last weekend.




Knuckle Rebuild Kit       04434-60015       1      $92      Gaskets and shims
   Outer axle oil seal       90311-62001       2       20/pr.  Optional
   Inner axle oil seal       90311-33085       2       12/pr.  Recommended
   Steering knuckle Bearing  90366-17001-77  0-4       30/ea   Dealer or rebuild kit
   Wheel bearing, inner      90368-     -77  0-2         /ea   Aftermarket cheaper
   Wheel bearing, outer      90368-45087-77  0-2       44/ea   Aftermarket cheaper

knuckle centering sst 
http://www.marlincrawler.com/hardware-tools/tools/knuckle-alignment-tool



AR-TTORA founder 22R bored.060,LCE stage II race cam http://pure-gas.org/    32/36weber, :driving: Marlin 1200 NON ceramic clutch, L52SHD+dualcase #2919, cable-locker, Yukon 5.29 gears, 35's, Allpro ebrake, front springs, and high steer, F150rears    RIP Nitro 9-29-07 :(  I sure miss him :down: MarlinCrawlerInc IS NOT affiliated with TrailGear in any way

 
 
 
 
 

Related Topics

10 Replies
2221 Views
Last post Dec 12, 2005, 05:31:03 PM
by kneedownnate
3 Replies
910 Views
Last post Aug 27, 2007, 12:59:14 PM
by Joe S.
3 Replies
1240 Views
Last post Aug 08, 2008, 06:20:17 PM
by RCKSQRL
7 Replies
1977 Views
Last post Dec 25, 2009, 02:56:44 PM
by TOY087
16 Replies
3128 Views
Last post May 15, 2017, 05:54:54 PM
by Hickory Nut