Topic: Muhammad cartoon and general rants regarding the state of the world!

[BLACKDOG]

I'm just glad she is standing behind what she believes in (or doesn't) and is leaving US when she is out of school.
When do you graduate anyway, TT? (you probably posted it here, but I'm too lazy to go back and look)
We have more then our fair share of whiners that complain about the state of the union but won't stand behind their words.
It's like when you work with someone that does nothing but pregnant dog and moan about how much they hate the company.
If you don't like it go somewhere else where you'll be happy.

I'm also very impressed   Or course, I'm only 21 so what do I know   I cannot stand the people who pregnant dog and moan about anything and everything, then when you ask them if they even voted, they say no!  As far as I'm concerned, you are allowed your thoughts and opinions, as long as you have the intelligence to back it up.  Tiger Toy obviously has the learning, but I tend to agree with Mark, I do think she has been misled.  I go to a state school in CA and have had teachers attempt to teach their class erroneous facts!!  Not just out of their ignorance, but deliberately slanting facts!!!  I have been kicked out of my share of classes for daring to debate these teachers.  Free thinking is a great idea, except when it opposes their views!!! 

Tigertoy, while I heartily disagree with a lot of what you are saying, I have the utmost respect for you, and some of your beliefs, simply due to the fact that you are willing to stand for them, and argue and debate with people who compltely disagree with you, while you are in the minority.  YOu keep coming back for me, which is impressive to me.

 I have enjoyed reading this entire discussion, and wish that I could participate more, but there are a lot of good points coming from both sides

[brainlessfool]

Overpopulation isn't really about people, it is about resources consumed.

so if ppl spent more time burning fuels they would screw less?

[Rocksurfer]

so if ppl spent more time burning fuels they would screw less?

  yup, turn that heater on high and it will be to hot to

[alwayzbroken]

Tigertoy is a she? My bad.

[kneedownnate]

LOL, and who is in charge of the tests? Hitler? Who determines genetic fitness? Ethical reproduction? What is that? How about mandatory abortions? Too dumb to practice safe sex? What are they going to do? Go to the 7-11 and buy a box of trojans? And how do you educate people who don't speak your language and have a very deep and justified distrust of westerners? Of course, people are trying to get people educated right now, but it takes years and years of work to develop enough trust with native populations to get them to listen to you. Hell from the sound of it, if you had your way, you would not be around to make the argument.

I shouldn't hafta explain ethical reproduction to somebody with your obvious intelligence now should I?  Put your emotions and angers aside and think about it for a second and you'll understand what I mean, I think everybody else here does.  And I like your idea of mandated abortions, maybe sans pain killers so they're afraid to fornicate again.  Man, you're cooler than I thought!  What is the safest sex?  Abstinence man, abstinence!  Keep your rooster in your pants if you can't afford to raise kids!  And think about it for a second, what I'm really saying about educating them is for the people who are trying to help them to do it, hopefully they trust them?  And as for your last statement, my IQ is pretty reasonable, and well below my parents, who evidently were financially and emotionally stable enough to raise 3 children, the last of which was adopted from korea and has undoubtedly led a much better life than being stuck in some orphanage or foster home in korea.  If I ever went hungry it was because I was buzzin around everywhere with boundless energy and needed replenishment, not because my parents couldn't afford to feed me today.  I may not be the brightest or even nicest individual (though I am arguably the most handsome ) , but I am smart enough to not reproduce unless I can provide a good life for my children.  But then again, maybe I'm the stupid one for thinking this way huh?

And I also feel that welfare should be cut way down, almost to the point of non-existence.  There are people who need the system, but they're far outweighed by those who are just lazy and abuse the system.

[Lady Di]

I may not be the brightest or even nicest individual (though I am arguably the most handsome )

  good one!! but the rest of what you said is, once again,           

[Lady Di]

Tigertoy is a she? My bad.

I thought TT was a guy all along until I looked at the profile, she doesn't CLAIM to be a she (no gender selected), but look at the email address. It's Jennifer something or other.

And BD in regard to being mislead by the universities, I totally agree with that too. There is a decidedly left slant to what they choose to put into the young minds.
A while back there was a big uproar about a school sanctioned trip for high schoolers to some left wing democratic rally of some sort.
A part of the argument was, 'but if this were a school sanctioned trip to some right wing republican rally would there be such an uproar'?
And my debate to that was 'If there were some right wing republican rally the question isn't would there be an uproar to a school sanctioned trip, but would they even think taking the students to it'. And my guess would be the answer would be a resounding NO!
But TT insists she has real world experience and so has not been slanted by unrealistic rosy colored university glasses. Guess we have to take her word on that, but that's not how it comes across to me.

[BLACKDOG]

I shouldn't hafta explain ethical reproduction to somebody with your obvious intelligence now should I?  Put your emotions and angers aside and think about it for a second and you'll understand what I mean, I think everybody else here does.  And I like your idea of mandated abortions, maybe sans pain killers so they're afraid to fornicate again.  Man, you're cooler than I thought!  What is the safest sex?  Abstinence man, abstinence!  Keep your rooster in your pants if you can't afford to raise kids!  And think about it for a second, what I'm really saying about educating them is for the people who are trying to help them to do it, hopefully they trust them?  And as for your last statement, my IQ is pretty reasonable, and well below my parents, who evidently were financially and emotionally stable enough to raise 3 children, the last of which was adopted from korea and has undoubtedly led a much better life than being stuck in some orphanage or foster home in korea.  If I ever went hungry it was because I was buzzin around everywhere with boundless energy and needed replenishment, not because my parents couldn't afford to feed me today.  I may not be the brightest or even nicest individual (though I am arguably the most handsome ) , but I am smart enough to not reproduce unless I can provide a good life for my children.  But then again, maybe I'm the stupid one for thinking this way huh?

And I also feel that welfare should be cut way down, almost to the point of non-existence.  There are people who need the system, but they're far outweighed by those who are just lazy and abuse the system.

  I can repeat that fomr myself, virtually word for word

[Lady Di]

I think this obituary fits in here nicely:

Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend, Mr. Common Sense.

Mr. Sense had been with us for many years. No one knows for sure how old he was since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape.

He will be remembered as having cultivated such value lessons as knowing when to come in out of the rain, why the early bird gets the worm and that life isn't always fair.

Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies (don't spend more than you earn) and reliable parenting strategies (adults, not kids, are in charge).

His health began to rapidly deteriorate when well intentioned but overbearing regulations were set in place.

Reports of a six-year-old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate; teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch; and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.

Mr. Sense declined even further when schools were required to get parental consent to administer aspirin to a student; but, could not inform the parents when a student became pregnant and wanted to have an abortion.

Finally, Common Sense lost the will to live as the Ten Commandments became contraband; churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.

Common Sense finally gave up the ghost after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot, she spilled a bit in her lap, and was awarded a huge financial settlement.


Common Sense was preceded in death by his parents, Truth and Trust, his wife, Discretion; his daughter, Responsibility; and his son, Reason.

He is survived by two stepbrothers; My Rights and Ima Whiner. (Ima Whiner )

Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone.

If you still remember him, pass this on; if not, join the majority and do nothing.

[yotatilla]

I have read that before, its good stuff. People are seriously dumb. The guy who put his RV on cruise control on the free way and decided to go out back and make some coffee? Seriously people. His RV obviously crashed and he was awarded an enourmous settlement and a new RV. His case was based on the manual, which didnt say that cruise control didn't steer the RV for you. DUMB.



Sam

[abnormaltoy [OP]]

We might have to change it to "uncommon sense". It's all too rare these days.
Mark

[abnormaltoy [OP]]

Although I'm more inclined towards other avenues...we might have to open up a glass factory over there.

http://news.yahoo.com/fc/world/religion

Maybe we could just wipe up the entire area with a ginormous tampon!
Mark

[TigerToy]

I am a he.  The email address is for my ex-wife and I probably need to go ahead and change it. 

Back to Africa.  There are many tribes in Africa that feel that women must prove their fertility before they can marry.  Anthropologists are trying to work to change that attitude, but it is difficult to change people's culture from the outside.  Like I said, it takes years and years of trust.  It would kinda be like coming to America and telling people they can't go to church or something.

BTW, I have not been misled.  Almost everything that I have learned that makes me dislike the way people in the US government handle things, especially foriegn policy, has come from reading outside of the classroom.  Like genocide in the Philipines at the turn of the century.  Or the support of Allende in Chile, Betancourt in Venezuela, Noriega in Panama, and Batista in Cuba.

Overpopulation is about resources consumed.  The problem with too many people is that there aren't enough resources to go around.  However, the U.S. consumes more resources than all the 'third world' countries combined.  I don't know the answer to overpopulation, honestly.  It seems like we should kill a couple of billion people just out of practicality.  However, being a good lefty, that goes against my human rights morality.  The second option is to try to deindustrialize at least a little bit, or at least set universal environmental standards for industry to follow.  You see, I think that the people who live in 'third world' countries live a lifestyle that is closer to a 'correct' human lifestyle.  Westerners are unbelievably wasteful (including myself; I don't want to sound like I'm accusing anyone.  We are all raised in situations where we take stuff like clean water for granted). 

Anyway, here is an anecdote illustrating how western wastefulness effects periphery countries.  In Mexico, many of the Mayans have been basically tenant farmers for thousands of years.  However, because of trade agreements, foriegn companies have been able to buy up the land that the tenant farmers worked (they were tenant farmers because land ownership had never been a part of Mayan culture except collectively.  Kingdoms owned land and fought wars over it, but individuals did not.)  Instead of growing their own food, now many Mayans become migrant workers or work in factories or for fruit companies - generally for unbelievably low wages.  So, the cheap fruit that you buy at the store (oranges mostly) costs the Mayans their way of life, in many ways.  Mayans don't even eat oranges, except occasionally with chile pepper on them.  This also hurts the milpa farming.  While they still use milpa farming, it is often for growing oranges for fruit companies since the fruit companies now own the land.  The lack of diversified crops hurts the soil quality.  Of course, there are initiatives to reallocate land to Mayans because of stuff like this.  There are also quite a few other movements like this in other Latin American countries.

[brainlessfool]

Overpopulation is about resources consumed.  The problem with too many people is that there aren't enough resources to go around. 

Oh I get it! so if a county grows it's population by say 8 times in 20 years it ok so long as there's gold laying around on the streets.

if there's just dirt on the streets (even tho that's the way it was 20 years ago)  then it's a problem .

Well I think gold or dirt if a county grows that fast (as some have done) then the ppl are the problem.

[Lady Di]

Instead of growing their own food, now many Mayans become migrant workers or work in factories or for fruit companies - generally for unbelievably low wages. So, the cheap fruit that you buy at the store (oranges mostly)

I don't know about you californian's but my oranges come from FL.

[abnormaltoy [OP]]

   Hello everybody. I've been out of the loop for a while, my computer has been crashing a lot the last day or two...I still don't know why, but it seems to have stopped 
  Well TT, we kind of, almost agree on some things, in a way! Some of the more primitive traditions in Africa and elsewhere are hindering progress. Some are in fact barbaric (female circumcisions).
   I fail to see what the problem was with our, the US, supporting (or not supporting) Allende or Noriega (although his case seemed to be an affair of convenience), et al. It true the genocide in the Philippines was a war crime to rival the Cambodian killing fields and should have peen punished, it should also not have been…”forgotten”. I freely admit, the only reason I know anything of this is that I had a Filipino friend that told me about it. It’s amazing that they fought by our side just 40 years later.
   Over population is not about “resources consumed”, it is quite simply, about too many people. Presuming that the main resource in question is food.
Too many people… in areas where there is “civil war”, as is the case in Somalia, Sudan, Kosovo and Serbia, where for years there has been enough food donated by the “evil westerners” but local warlords interfered.  I think, if you’ll look, most, if not all, areas of the world that are considered "3rd world" or have extreme prolonged problems feeding themselves are…under some type of socialist control.
Too many people… with restrictive religious beliefs. In the Hindu world, their beliefs keep them from killing vermin that infest grain stores and from slaughtering and eating animals. 
   The cause celebre lately has been the hurricanes this past season (Yes, Mayor Nagin…Katrina was all natural). But weather has always played a part in hunger crises... in Southeast Asia due to the tsunami and seasonal monsoons... in South and Central America semi-regular flooding causes less prolonged, but no less severe to the locals, problems.
    I really think the main difference between me and the socialists is…attitude. My glass is always half full. Socialists won’t even admit they have a glass. The Socialists are almost Muslin-like in their tolerance for capitalism. I read a slogan once that read, probably not verbatim, "No socialist country can stand alone in a sea of capitalism". That , with a few changes, is the mantra of the islamic fanatics…no?
I don’t know the origin of this, but there is a saying that “Freedom is the answer, what is the question”... says quite a lot. Free people, unhindered by government can pretty much take care of the world. There are some people that don't care if everyone has nothing, as long as somebody doesn't have more than someone else.
    Sorry about the misunderstanding of your gender. I enjoy these little chats...really!
    Mark 
     

[Lady Di]

and I love reading both your and TT's sides of this, it is really enlightening! Thank you

[gedean]

Here's my solution to the overpopulation problem... as well as a myraid of other problems the U.S. faces. 
When a child is born they perform a simple easily reversable surgical procedure (such as a vasectomy for males... don't know for females) that will not allow them to procreate until the surgury is un-done.  Once the person is of age (legal adult) they can either take a easy test (showing basic inteligence) or submit a W-2 (showing that they do in fact have a job) and then the operation is reversed at no cost.  This eliminates unwanted pregnancies, most abortions, and a lot of welfare children.  Yeah it might seem scary and a little Naziish, but dont' you think it would work?  I think it would.

As for the Iran situation...
Ask them to stop.  Delay things diplomats shouldn't have any problem doing that.  Act like we are not going to take any military action.  Then without anyone knowing, move a nuke of our own into the country and near where their program is taking place.  Detonate said bomb.  Tell the whole world they blew themselves up and "I told you so".  Problem soved. 

[BLACKDOG]

Here's my solution to the overpopulation problem... as well as a myraid of other problems the U.S. faces. 
When a child is born they perform a simple easily reversable surgical procedure (such as a vasectomy for males... don't know for females) that will not allow them to procreate until the surgury is un-done.  Once the person is of age (legal adult) they can either take a easy test (showing basic inteligence) or submit a W-2 (showing that they do in fact have a job) and then the operation is reversed at no cost.  This eliminates unwanted pregnancies, most abortions, and a lot of welfare children.  Yeah it might seem scary and a little Naziish, but dont' you think it would work?  I think it would.

As for the Iran situation...
Ask them to stop.  Delay things diplomats shouldn't have any problem doing that.  Act like we are not going to take any military action.  Then without anyone knowing, move a nuke of our own into the country and near where their program is taking place.  Detonate said bomb.  Tell the whole world they blew themselves up and "I told you so".  Problem soved. 

at least I like the second one  

as for the first option, hows this one?  We bring back Mr. common sense from the dead, quit giving people handouts, and when some jackass dies or gets hurt for putting his RV on cruise control and getting up and moving around, we laugh in their face, and slap them with a fine or something for endagering other people.  Then we do a sterilization surgery on them, because they are obviously to stupid to procreate how's that sound?