Author Topic: Duals Setup HELP!  (Read 423 times)

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jperalta8

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Duals Setup HELP!
« on: Apr 04, 2020, 06:53:38 PM »
Hello guys,
 
After looking pages and reading reviews, I decided to go with a Marlin Crawler dual case because of realiability and experience on the market.

So, I've spent a couple of days searching on the forum, reading a lot on MC web page and other forums but I still haven't found the piece of info that I need.

Look, I have a 1991 3.0 (3VZ) with R150F trans (I think it is fwd shift because the 4wd shifter is next to the 1-5-R shifter) and chain drive t/case (don't know the name, just the gear ratio 2.57:1). Could you tell me if the MC10_unit will fit my driveline? (if not recommend me something that will work). I would like to keep my trans and my t/case because they are in pristine condition because the truck hasn't seen much driving nor off roading besides I need to save as much $$$ as posible.

Lastly, do you sell a twin stick to adapt to my chain t/case or something? I would need something that could prevent me to make a hole on my center console.

Thanks for the help.

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #1 on: Apr 05, 2020, 12:27:57 AM »
To run dual cases with your V6, you will need to buy an adapter for your transmission to adapt to a gear driven transfer case to it
https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-unit
then buy/build your your dual cases using 23 spline input gears for both cases.
https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-complete

Another option would be to find a 5-speed and transfer case out of a 22re turbo truck, as the trans is an R series like the V6's, and the transfer case uses 23 spline input shaft from the factory, then you would only need to buy a 23 spline Crawler Box, but they are rare and pricey now.
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #2 on: Apr 05, 2020, 09:59:10 AM »
To run dual cases with your V6, you will need to buy an adapter for your transmission to adapt to a gear driven transfer case to it
https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-unit
then buy/build your your dual cases using 23 spline input gears for both cases.
https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-complete

Another option would be to find a 5-speed and transfer case out of a 22re turbo truck, as the trans is an R series like the V6's, and the transfer case uses 23 spline input shaft from the factory, then you would only need to buy a 23 spline Crawler Box, but they are rare and pricey now.

Thanks for the reply Snowtoy.

1. When you say an adapter, you refer to an adapter that alters my transmission bolt pattern, but where can I buy that adapter?
2. When you say buy or build my dual cases with 23 spline, you gave me this link (https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-complete), but that is for 4cyl and I have a v6 case, wouldn't this be the appropiate link (https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/dual-case/hilux-gear-drive-conversion/dual-case-complete) ? or, could I adapt a 4cyl duals cases to my R150F trans?

Thanks for the cooperation.


gnob

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #3 on: Apr 05, 2020, 10:47:30 AM »
I thought Marlin used to do adapter plates to use a 4cyl crawl box in front of the old 3.0 chaindrive but i dont see it on the site now. Maybe call.
Otherwise you will need to build dual 23 spline gear drive case set with adapter for your r150.
This is what I run behind my 3.4.
hold this. . .

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #4 on: Apr 05, 2020, 11:10:08 AM »
I thought Marlin used to do adapter plates to use a 4cyl crawl box in front of the old 3.0 chaindrive but i dont see it on the site now. Maybe call.
Otherwise you will need to build dual 23 spline gear drive case set with adapter for your r150.
This is what I run behind my 3.4.

That is what I am thinking. The dual case complete for the V6 (Hilux_Dual_6cyl) has an aluminum adapter but that must be expensive. I thought that I could find something to bolt on with adapters like the MC10_UNIT so I could use my chain t/case.

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #5 on: Apr 05, 2020, 01:40:09 PM »
Thanks for the reply Snowtoy.

1. When you say an adapter, you refer to an adapter that alters my transmission bolt pattern, but where can I buy that adapter?
Correct, the adapter changes the bolt pattern of your V6 R150 transmission to the 4 cylinder gear driven transfer case, andI thought it was in the first link.  Must have copied the wrong one, here is the correct link of what you will need once it is back in stock.
https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/adapters/bolt-pattern/3-0-liter-v6-drivetrains
Quote
2. When you say buy or build my dual cases with 23 spline, you gave me this link (https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/built-units/hilux-gear-drive/dual-case-complete), but that is for 4cyl and I have a v6 case, wouldn't this be the appropiate link (https://www.marlincrawler.com/transfer-case/dual-case/hilux-gear-drive-conversion/dual-case-complete) ? or, could I adapt a 4cyl duals cases to my R150F trans?

That is the correct link, you will need to acquire two complete 4 cyl. transfer cases, to use in your build, along with two 23 spline input gear kits.  The 23 spline t-case is what was used with the 22re turbo trucks built in the -86-'87 model years, and are what is needed to handle the torque of the v-6, the 21 spline 4 cyl. gears will break.

Looking at the site, it looks like you will spend about $2400 for duals, plus whatever your local driveline shop charges to modify your drivelines, guessing another $500, and you will also need to get a dual case crossmember/skid plate, or have something fabricated using the existing x-member.
http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/dual-transfer-case-crossmember-skidplate.html

What type of wheeling do you do or plan to do?
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #6 on: Apr 05, 2020, 01:54:25 PM »
I thought Marlin used to do adapter plates to use a 4cyl crawl box in front of the old 3.0 chaindrive but i dont see it on the site now. Maybe call.
Otherwise you will need to build dual 23 spline gear drive case set with adapter for your r150.
This is what I run behind my 3.4.
I remember that adapter from a few years ago as well, but I didn't see it listed anymore, nor seen it available thru AdvanceAdapter, so I didn't bother mentioning it.  I am guessing that if the 3.4 trans-to-transfercase bolt patterns was the same are the same 3.0's, the 3.0 would be listed under the Taco crawl box listing as an option.
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #7 on: Apr 05, 2020, 02:45:02 PM »
That is what I am thinking. The dual case complete for the V6 (Hilux_Dual_6cyl) has an aluminum adapter but that must be expensive. I thought that I could find something to bolt on with adapters like the MC10_UNIT so I could use my chain t/case.

Mainly mudding and some steep hills with rocks but not big boulders

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #8 on: Apr 05, 2020, 03:50:54 PM »
If rock crawling isn't what you mainly do, then dual cases aren't really needed.  What percentage of your wheeling is done in 4 Hi, and 4-Low?  If mainly in 4-Hi, and you find 4-Low isn't low enough for your needs, you could go with a single gear driven case with 4.70 gears, and just the one adapter plate.  The 4.7 gears will basically give you dual stock cases, which will help with controlling wheel speed for dry hill climbs and any of the larger rocks you are finding you have to hit at speed or stall out on on the trails you run.  Of course, with the 4.7 single case, if/when you do use 4-Low now you are usually in 1st or 2nd gear, with the 4.7's you will likely use 4th-5th gear, unless needing to creep along.

One trick that can help, if you have it, is kicking on the A/C, it will put enough drag on the engine while increasing the engine speed, to help reduce stall while trying to creep along, not so much for climbing onto a rock or ledge, but with descending them.
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #9 on: Apr 05, 2020, 06:05:17 PM »
If rock crawling isn't what you mainly do, then dual cases aren't really needed.  What percentage of your wheeling is done in 4 Hi, and 4-Low?  If mainly in 4-Hi, and you find 4-Low isn't low enough for your needs, you could go with a single gear driven case with 4.70 gears, and just the one adapter plate.  The 4.7 gears will basically give you dual stock cases, which will help with controlling wheel speed for dry hill climbs and any of the larger rocks you are finding you have to hit at speed or stall out on on the trails you run.  Of course, with the 4.7 single case, if/when you do use 4-Low now you are usually in 1st or 2nd gear, with the 4.7's you will likely use 4th-5th gear, unless needing to creep along.

One trick that can help, if you have it, is kicking on the A/C, it will put enough drag on the engine while increasing the engine speed, to help reduce stall while trying to creep along, not so much for climbing onto a rock or ledge, but with descending them.

Sure, I've calculated the ratios and thus the seed at any RPM, and taking account of the tires that I want to install and the mudding, climbing and sometimes racing, I need dual cases with 2.28. One case 4.7 would be too slow.

But thanks for your advice. Anyway, one case with 4.7 is more o less the winning option right now.


jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #10 on: Apr 06, 2020, 02:04:42 PM »
If rock crawling isn't what you mainly do, then dual cases aren't really needed.  What percentage of your wheeling is done in 4 Hi, and 4-Low?  If mainly in 4-Hi, and you find 4-Low isn't low enough for your needs, you could go with a single gear driven case with 4.70 gears, and just the one adapter plate.  The 4.7 gears will basically give you dual stock cases, which will help with controlling wheel speed for dry hill climbs and any of the larger rocks you are finding you have to hit at speed or stall out on on the trails you run.  Of course, with the 4.7 single case, if/when you do use 4-Low now you are usually in 1st or 2nd gear, with the 4.7's you will likely use 4th-5th gear, unless needing to creep along.

One trick that can help, if you have it, is kicking on the A/C, it will put enough drag on the engine while increasing the engine speed, to help reduce stall while trying to creep along, not so much for climbing onto a rock or ledge, but with descending them.

4hi 0% 4Low 100%

In a combination of 2.28 front case and 4.7 rear case, is it posible to use 90% of the time (around 3 hours of the trail) the front case in 2.28 LOW and the rear case in HI an only use the LOW LOW 10% percent of the time (when the trail gets really dificult)? I mean, Using just the front case in LOW and the rear in hig, for long periods of time, will it break the crawl box or wear it prematurely?

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #11 on: Apr 06, 2020, 02:42:02 PM »
In a combination of 2.28 front case and 4.7 rear case, is it posible to use 90% of the time (around 3 hours of the trail) the front case in 2.28 LOW and the rear case in HI an only use the LOW LOW 10% percent of the time (when the trail gets really dificult)? I mean, Using just the front case in LOW and the rear in hig, for long periods of time, will it break the crawl box or wear it prematurely?
Yes you should be fine, the wear would be the same as if it was just a single case.  Outside of being on the highway, I almost always run in low, prefer the lower torque for taking off with low psi in the tires, and for increased engine breaking for avoiding potholes/ruts on fire/logging roads.
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #12 on: Apr 06, 2020, 09:52:24 PM »
Yes you should be fine, the wear would be the same as if it was just a single case.  Outside of being on the highway, I almost always run in low, prefer the lower torque for taking off with low psi in the tires, and for increased engine breaking for avoiding potholes/ruts on fire/logging roads.

Yeah, sure. And after all the 23 spline t/case recieving 2.28 in hih won't brake anything easly because it is reiforced.

Thanks for all the info SnowToy.

So far, I will go with the dual case complete with 2.28 front and 4.7 rear. What I am thincking now is if I will go with twin sticks or not. The only benefit of twin sticks is 2 extra combinatios:
-2WD 4.7
-2WD 2.28*4.7
both combinations won't be used at all (at least by me), so I think I will save $250 to $300.

Which type of stick do you have on your t/case SnowToy?

Snowtoy

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #13 on: Apr 07, 2020, 12:07:17 AM »
So far, I will go with the dual case complete with 2.28 front and 4.7 rear. What I am thincking now is if I will go with twin sticks or not. The only benefit of twin sticks is 2 extra combinatios:
-2WD 4.7
-2WD 2.28*4.7
both combinations won't be used at all (at least by me), so I think I will save $250 to $300.
Yes, that would be one of the benefits of the twin stick, however, you could still have the combinations in 2wd in situations where you didn't have the hubs locked.

Quote
Which type of stick do you have on your t/case SnowToy?
Just the single stick, twin sticks wouldn't work with my set-up, can't remember if they were even available back then.  I modified the crawl box and t-case sticks to be side by side, to give me a spot to locate switches on the center console, for tire compressor, ARB compressor, and rock lights.
,

I have thought about buying the lowrangeoffroad triple stick set-up, and modifying it too work, just haven't ever gotten around to it.
http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/top-shift-dual-case-triple-stick-kit-by-radesigns-rd-tsk.html
'90 black X-cab mod'd 3.0, 33's/4.88's, rear ARB, custom bumpers, sliders, safari rack, etc.
'91 Blue X-cab 22re, 35's/5.29's,Truetrac front, ARB rear, dual cases, and custom Safari flatbed, bumper, interior.
The money pit '87 Supra resto/mod

jperalta8 [OP]

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Re: Duals Setup HELP!
« Reply #14 on: Apr 07, 2020, 08:25:14 AM »
That set up looks awesome SnowToy. I'll go single stick, and save the money for a transfer case e-brake.

 
 
 
 
 

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