Author Topic: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5  (Read 459 times)

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bub

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Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« on: Feb 14, 2020, 10:43:27 AM »
Ive got an 81 pickup with an elocker rear end and I just grenaded my 3rd ring and pinion in as many years.  :hammerhead: I broke a set of Yukons, Nitros, and Revolution Gears. I just did a diff rebuild on the lakebed at KOH after blowing up a set on Outer Limits and then 7 days later I broke a ring gear tooth on Chocolate. Im running 5.29s with a 2.28x4.7 doubler and a 22r for power (soon to be 3rz). Ive also got about 600+ lbs of tools and spares in the bed.

I thinking Ive reached the limit of the Toyota 8 R&P, so I think its time to upgrade. I have a buddy with a couple LC 9.5 full float and semi float axles I could get for cheap, or build a new ford 9. Heres the pros and cons from what Ive researched so far:

Ford 9:
Pros
Can maintain 60 wms
Parts readily available from many suppliers
Triple pinion bearings
Ground clearance less than .5 worse than Toyota 8
Cons
Very low pinion

80 series:
Pros
Toyota axle, less customization needed
Full float
Disc brakes
Cons
Offset 3rd (driveline vibrations?)
63.5 wms

Does any one have an argument one way or the other? TIA
'81 p/u locked with duals, 63's on 37's
'03 Chevy 2500HD SAS with '79 KP D60

redneckcustoms13

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #1 on: Feb 14, 2020, 06:50:58 PM »
Offset driveline wouldnt necessarily translate to vibrations. The 9.5 toyota front we built and put in a buggy with a turbo propane v8 is still holding up to rock bouncing with 38.5 boggers on steel beadlocks.

My question is wtf are you doing to break so many? 5000 rpm clutch dumps with 44s? Trying to snatch people out? Seriously undercut obstacles causing a driveline bind? I have never heard of so many failures where it wasnt just shear abuse.
83 long bed 2wd sas, 3rz, w56, duals with 4.7 rear, 4.88 elock front, spartan rear, 39.5 iroks
01 double cab hunting truck
06 tacoma street truck

bub [OP]

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #2 on: Feb 14, 2020, 09:23:42 PM »
Not too many shenanigans usually. I like to think i'm a pretty conservative driver. The first R&P happened at Sand Hollow on Nasty Half, that was definitely abuse on my part. The second one I am not sure exactly what happened, my only guess is that it was related to my front locker failing just before the rear R&P. The third one i was in 2nd gear double low on a waterfall roasting the tires for a minute, but nothing too crazy.

The carrier in my elocker was damaged when i got it (3 ring gear bolts backed out and two got into the gears/carrier). I repaired the carrier (welded/grinded/filed), and have been running it since. The only thing i can think is that maybe the carrier is deflecting more than its supposed to and that's causing my failures.  :confused:
'81 p/u locked with duals, 63's on 37's
'03 Chevy 2500HD SAS with '79 KP D60

Gnarly4X

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #3 on: Feb 15, 2020, 03:18:54 AM »
Hey bub,

In over 20 years of 90% rock crawling (mild to wild) it was rare to see or hear about premature failure of a ring & pinion.  The one time I do remember witnessing a ring & pinion failure was on a Scout rock crawling in Las Cruces NM on a nasty obstacle. The rear axle shaft snapped, that caused the Detroit Locker to grenade the ring & pinion.
 :smack:

I have a feeling theres a common denominator to your failures.  The word flex comes to mind first. Is something flexing too much?

Did the 3 failures happen on the same axle housing?

There could be a quality issue with the ring & pinions?

There could be an issue with the installation?

If I were you, Id make a phone call to Currie Enterprises.  John and Ray are really nice guys  -  I wheeled them back in 94 on the Dusy Ershim.  Id bet a 6-pack there is no one on the planet that knows more about axles & ring & pinions than Currie.  Theyve earned their reputation since 1959.  :thumbs:

Of Course Randy Lyman has been around since the early 80s.  I'd be very interested to get an opinion from both experts. :yesnod:

I'm curious..... why 600 lbs. of freight?  :dunno:

Let us know what you find out or how your axle does in the future.

Gnarls. :gap:
« Last Edit: Feb 15, 2020, 03:33:23 AM by Gnarly4X »
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gnob

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #4 on: Feb 15, 2020, 10:29:09 AM »
Whos actually setting up your diffs?
The elocker is kind of a thingy to get set up tight like a tiger.
hold this. . .

redneckcustoms13

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #5 on: Feb 15, 2020, 12:05:35 PM »
I'm not saying an 8" is an indestructible item. I've killed a few but it was in a mud truck with v8 power and 44" boggers. I've seen plenty fail. But they were mostly all due to lack of lubrication or abuse.

Either way you choose to go I think you'll be happy.
83 long bed 2wd sas, 3rz, w56, duals with 4.7 rear, 4.88 elock front, spartan rear, 39.5 iroks
01 double cab hunting truck
06 tacoma street truck

Rockcrawlintoy

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #6 on: Feb 15, 2020, 04:11:52 PM »
What size tires? I would be looking at the 9 inch and ass a load bolt. I would also be taking that 600 lbs of stuff out of the bed lll
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bub [OP]

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Re: Ford 9 vs 80 Series 9.5
« Reply #7 on: Feb 15, 2020, 08:28:19 PM »
So my estimate of 600lbs was a tad high. I took everything out today and weighed it and Im at 450lbs including my spare tire, spare front axle shafts, one spare rear shaft, tools, fluids and recovery gear. I dont think thats too excessive. Allows me to be fairly prepared on the trail which I like.

Im on 37 MTRs (newer style), usually run 7-9 psi in them depending on conditions.

Ive setup the diffs myself each time and gotten a good pattern with preload and backlash within spec/a little towards the tighter side.

Tomorrow Im going to pull the chunk and see if that gives me anymore info about the failure point. Im thinking (hoping) its related to the repair I made on the carrier. Ill post some pics of the gear pattern and the latest broken gear soon.
'81 p/u locked with duals, 63's on 37's
'03 Chevy 2500HD SAS with '79 KP D60

 
 
 
 
 

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