Author Topic: Cporche's engine fiasco  (Read 2513 times)

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Re: Cporche's engine fiasco
« on: Mar 16, 2018, 03:17:06 AM »
Hey cporche,

For what it may be worth, here are my thoughts….

On your first failed long block….

Based upon your comments and your description of the engine failure, which appears to be catastrophic, I find it difficult to understand what parts were used, what machining was done to the block, and who assembled the long block?  Did the shop rebuild the long block or did they buy it from an eBay supplier and sell it to you?
“The shop i bought it from assembled the long block, i am unsure of weather they performed the actual machining or it was outsourced. i seem to believe it was outsourced tho i vaguely remember him saying he would have to send it out.:

>>> So it was NOT your block from your Runner?  What is the source?

On your new rebuilt long block… What specific machining was done to the block?
“I tried to get this information from him, he would only reply with everything is to the manufactures spec to that part. i asked several times if chrome coated rings require special machining. He said the machinest was given the ring information and machined it accordingly.”

>>>> If a machine shop, auto shop, or engine builder cannot or will not provide you this information, they are scamming you.  Who is “the manufacturer”?

What new parts were used?
“to my knowledge everything is new except the crank and rods, new aftermarket head, timing cover, timing components, gaskets, new rv cam, new bearings. Let me reiterate he was kind of beating around the bush with me when i asked”

>>> This guy is a not telling you the facts for a reason… he’s not honest, and therefore appears to be a crook and a fraud, or doesn’t have a clue what he’s doing.

Other than NPR rings, whose parts were used?
“The parts kit based on what the boxes looked like when i picked up the motor was evergreen”

>>>> Evergreen is a distributor.  NPR is supposedly a Japanese manufacturer, but NPR is known to be a poor quality product by at least one top 22R/RE engine builder, and will not be used.  I believe chrome rings are not typically used or recommended for street 22 rebuilds.  Usually Moly rings are used.

Was the head rebuilt or new?
"New aftermarket (i can confirm aftermarket based on the poor machining quality it wouldnt have passed any oem quality check.)”

>>>> So this guy would NOT tell you the source of this new head?  Is that a BIG RED FLAG!!??

What camshaft was installed and what valve lash was set?
“He said rv 261 cam, .005 in and .007 exhaust. It is very tight but the cam card does reflect this however he didnt give me a copy of it, and i couldnt see the manufacturer.”

>>>> Is this cam from engnbldr?  If it is, the valve lash specs are WRONG!!  Engnbldr’s 261C is spec’d at .007"
 for Intake and .009” for Exhaust.  I’ve never seen a 22R/RE cam spec with valve specs that tight!

Did this shop recommend a break-in procedure?
“He did not mention the oil priming that i performed, he said just dump them over the cam and crank with out plugs until oil pressure builds. I have the tool tho, why not use it and give the motor the best chance of no failing. Everything else other then first oil filter change at 50 miles. I waited until 300 miles and did an entire oil change.”

>>>> So, he did NOT mention how the break-in his newly rebuilt engine???  If he didn’t tell you what he recommended for a break-in procedure he is stupid!

How many miles on the break-in now and how much oil is it using?
“~650 miles i have 2 tanks on this oil change sofar and the oil has not dropped. However i have to fill up today on the way home hopefully i will see no change but i will update if there is. also he instructed me that it needs to be 1/4 inch above the full line on the dipstick, he claims toyota never made a different stick for 4x4 and the oil level is too low on incline. I call bull crap but until im out of warranty im abiding by his rules”

>>> I have NEVER heard of anyone saying or recommending to over fill a dip stick reading!!   ¼” above the full mark on a 22 dip stick would equal a tad less than ½ quart.  That is clearly ignorant.. over filling a crankcase can cause foaming, lubrication starving, and blown seals.  He probably told you that to prevent you from running low on oil before you noticed it… another indication this guy is stupid.

What are the engine specs and all parts used?
“I have no spec sheet from the rebuild so i have to take his word for everything is "at spec now"”

>>>>>  No specifications of the rebuild?... another reason to believe this guy is a scam.  “at spec now”… what the hell does that mean?  WHOSE SPECS???  What hone grit and RA did is spec'd? What crosshatch did the machine shop machine?  That specification is critical!!

What oil are you using?
“Right now its got rotella 10-40 per his request.”

>>> I assume its NOT Rotella T, which is synthetic?

Quote from: EASYRYDERDANGER on Yesterday at 09:29:33 PM
Sound like u may have been concerned so I'll let you know that the aftermarket head is most likely better than the OEM one that was on there.  The stock japanese ones are known for their porous  aluminum.

“Im not saying because its aftermarket that its of poor quality or anything of the sort, ive worked in independent automotive repair most of my career, however the intake holes not lining up (as pictures with gasket on the head) and having to tap the exhaust manifold stud holes does give me low confidence in how well the head was machined.”

>>> That head was NOT a quality head and sounds like the worst aftermarket head I’ve read about.  If that is the poor quality of parts that guy is using, he’s an idiot!!  Was it new or remanufactured?

Although possible, I am unaware of a historical porosity problem with factory “stock Japanese” 22 heads.  I do know that, according to my local head shop, that the factory 22 head has a problem with #3 chamber where the water port cracks across to the chamber, and (other than overheating) electrolysis is a major cause of the alloy head corrosion and head gasket failure.

Cporche… I’m very surprised that you say you have “worked in independent automotive repair most of my career” and have gone through this ordeal without getting the facts, the specifications, checking out the reputation of your engine builder, the sources of the parts, the suppliers, and end up having a guy and shop sell you an engine that clearly was JUNK.

Other than racing circles, it is rare that a rebuild shop or distributor would not reveal every aspect of their engine specs and sources.

Did this guy provide you a Warranty?  I am surprised that he did rebuild your fubar'd engine... that is one positive and commendable aspect about the guy.

I always hate to read about someone going through your kind of "fiasco".  :down:

Gnarls.  :dunno:
« Last Edit: Mar 16, 2018, 06:53:18 AM by Gnarly4X »
1986 XtraCab SR5 22RE 5speed W56B, ~26,000 MI after break-in, DIM (Did It Myself) rebuilt engine - .020" over, engnbldr RV head, OS valves, 261C cam, DT Header.

MEMBER: NRA, GOA, SAF "I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you" ~ Robin Williams


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