Author Topic: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe  (Read 4752 times)

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MiniSimp

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FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« on: Apr 19, 2005, 09:12:57 AM »
:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
Tube vs Pipe
» What is Tube?
» What is Pipe?
» What's the difference between Tube and Pipe?
» Types of Tube and Pipe

What is Tube?
A common debate featured in off road forums and general questions asked by builders of roll over protection structures (roll cages) are: what is the difference between tube and pipe and which one is better?

Firstly the definition of tube.
 
Tube:
A tube refers to cylindrical, square, rectangular or any shape of hollow material of uniform thickness measured by two dimensions, the outside diameter (OD) and wall thickness (t or w). Tubing types available are structural, mechanical and pressure.
 
• Tubing types available are structural, mechanical and pressure. Structural and Mechanical tube are used for roll over protection structures (roll cages) but it is the specifications; the grade of the steel and process used to form the tubing that is important.

• Tubing (such as copper tube) is used to carry fluids and gases in pneumatic, hydraulic, or process applications.

• Tubing differs from pipe in that it's outside diameter / size is controlled and used for its designation. Pipes inside diameter are controlled.

What is Pipe?
The definition of pipe is somewhat different than tube. Historically, the general term for pipe was that it was primarily used for carrying gas or liquid.

Let's have a look at the definition of pipe.

Pipe:
Pipe is specified for the containment of liquids and gasses as opposed to structural or mechanical purposes. Circular Hollow Sections, the outside diameter and wall thickness (described by the term "schedule") of which are identified by one of the pipe specification systems, such as IPS; which usually carries a liquid or gas.
 
• Pipe is generally more rigid than tube, and is usually produced in heavier wall thicknesses.

• The importance of tensile strength in pipe is focused on internal pressure. The burst test is used to measure resistance in hydrostatic pressure (the force caused by fluid under pressure).

• Pipe is specified by a nominal dimension which bears little or no resemblance to the actual dimensions of the pipe. 1" Schedule 40 pipe, for instance, has an actual OD of 1.32", a wall of 0.133", and an inner diameter of 1.049". Tube dimensions are actual dimensions.

What's the difference between Tube and Pipe?
The general term for pipe was that it was primarily used for carrying gas or liquid. It was not intended for structural use because the dimensions used in describing pipe was not dimensionally accurate. Measurement was referred to its inside diameter and wall thickness. The inside diameter was a true dimension, but over the years had become "nominal" (in name only) so that when pipe size was referred to, it was an approximate inside diameter measurement with the thickness described by the term "schedule".

• Pipe is generally more rigid than tube, and is usually produced in heavier wall thicknesses.

• Pipe is specified by a nominal dimension which bears little or no resemblance to the actual dimensions of the pipe. 1" Schedule 40 pipe, for instance, has an actual OD of 1.32", a wall of 0.133", and an inner diameter of 1.049". Tube dimensions are actual dimensions.

• Pipe fittings are sized to meet pipe sizes, but not tube sizes. A 1" schedule 40 nipple will fit correctly on a 1" schedule 40 pipe, but not on a 1" OD tube.

Tube refers to round, square, rectangular or any shape of hollow material of uniform thickness which is defined by the outside diameter and wall thickness dimensions. It is the grade of the metals and how tube is produced and processed that is important.

• Structural Tube is generally produced using the ERW (Electric Resistance Welded) process. Identified under the Circular Hollow Section (CHS) or Hollow Structural Sections (HSS) class. Some steel mills specifically develop structural tube for roll over protective structures.

• Mechanical Tubing is usually produced as seamless, as-welded or DOM (Drawn Over Mandrel) tube.

Types of Tube and Pipe

Structural Tube - high strength welded steel tubing 
Mechanical Tube - seamless, as-welded and drawn over mandrel 
Stainless Tubing and Pipe - several seamless and welding processes requiring resistance to corrosive materials 
Standard Pipe - several seamless or electric weld process, carries liquid or gas

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #1 on: Apr 19, 2005, 09:16:17 AM »
 :working: :biggthumpup:
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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #2 on: Apr 19, 2005, 03:44:28 PM »
So...what you are saying is that my rollcage is a toilet??  :smack:
You have a Jeep?  That's cute.... So does Barbi.

MiniSimp [OP]

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #3 on: Apr 19, 2005, 03:55:01 PM »
I'd never say that.

I've seen many good Pipe exo cages.

Booger has a great one.

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #4 on: Apr 19, 2005, 04:11:52 PM »
I was just kidding :yupyup: ...... but some people (mostly on other boards) seem to get really worked up over this issue  :maddest:  :tantrum: .  When I started my flatbed\cage I asked a guy I know that ownes\opperates a fab\welding shop (that was alot of \'s) for a good material to use and he got me 1 1/2 sch 40.  I trust him totally.  Maybe dom would have been a better choice and or lighter...but at the time and for the money...I would do it again.  :thumbs:
You have a Jeep?  That's cute.... So does Barbi.

MiniSimp [OP]

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #5 on: Apr 19, 2005, 05:30:11 PM »
Booger's (Paul) pipe cage


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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #6 on: Apr 20, 2005, 08:35:56 PM »
both work well....and can even work together if you are like me..until I pulled my exo and started on my dovetail.
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freds40

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #7 on: Apr 21, 2005, 09:49:45 AM »
Paul is running a little of both on his new truck. I've heard that pipe is a bit more difficult to bend (requires more muscle)
"between projects"

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #8 on: Apr 21, 2005, 01:07:19 PM »
As always, it comes down to cost vs. performance.  I think Minisimp has definitely done his homework on this one.:thumbs:

In general, I think "pipe" gets a black eye because few if any of the racing organizations that specify roll cage requirements allow pipe as a suitable material and this is probably due to the metallurgy, manufacturing process, and testing criteria.  However, it looks like there are different types of pipe, some more suitable than others for mechanical applications.  The generally thicker wall has to help it make up for the lower mechanical properties.

I consulted the Ryerson catalog and it looks like they sell (3) types of pipe:
     Type 1. Continuous Buttweld that meets ASTM A53 Type F..."not intended for close coiling, bending..."
     Type 2. ERW that meets ASTM A53 Grade B Type E..."suitable for bending...pressure tested..."
     Type 3. Pipe Size ERW that meets ASTM A500..."structural purpose pipe-sized tube that offers higher strength, better straightness, superior finish, and usually costs less than pipe"

Furthermore, looking at what is offered by Ryerson, it appears that the lighter SCH 10 pipe is exclusively offer in the Type 3 above.  SCH 40 is mostly offered in types 1 and 3 for sizes smaller than 2".  So, the off-the-shelf, buy it from Home Depot pipe is most likely going to be Butt Welded A53F which is "Not intended for close coiling, bending, or high temp service." 

The ERW pipe might be suitable although I haven't cross-checked A500 relative to the tube standard A513 and I'm not sure that I can.  Section-II of the ASME Pressure Vessel Code doesn't list any information on A500 since it is apparently not allowed for use in this code either.  The code does list a bunch of info on A513.

Yet another quote from Ryerson:  "Buttweld is similar to Ry-Star (many advantages of DOM at buttweld price) but produced from continuous welded pipe.  Does not offer the inherent strength in the weld area of an ERW product...Machinability and mechanical properties are reduced as a result of lower carbon content.  Meets ASTM A512."

All that said, it looks like you want to avoid Continuous Buttweld material as the strength is relatively low and so is the weld.  It appears that there are ERW, DOM, and hybrid options that are more suitable for mechanical applications.

By the way, that is a sweet exo.
If it never breaks, people can only speculate how much it was overbuilt.

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #9 on: Mar 22, 2006, 09:37:23 PM »
Dang-it it's tube noob.
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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #10 on: Mar 22, 2006, 10:02:05 PM »
Why did we bring this back(AKA: why is it not a sticky?)

CTENG in KS

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #11 on: Mar 23, 2006, 09:49:21 AM »
I don't know...

"LONG LIVE THE SQUARE TUBE!"
IFS is best kept at ambient temperature in a pile of scrap in the backyard.  When kept under a functioning vehicle, it tends to greatly diminish said vehicle's offroad ability.     -reklund5

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CTENG in KS

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #12 on: Jul 17, 2007, 12:58:27 PM »
Here is an oldy but goody...

Question:  Where are you buying your poop pipe at?
IFS is best kept at ambient temperature in a pile of scrap in the backyard.  When kept under a functioning vehicle, it tends to greatly diminish said vehicle's offroad ability.     -reklund5

4Runner: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=4580.0
Beastmaster: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=34339.0

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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #13 on: Jul 17, 2007, 05:28:31 PM »
Here is an oldy but goody...

Question:  Where are you buying your poop pipe at?

The hardware store I used to work at stocked it (ACE)  for contractors.  It actually came from a company called Slakey Brothers, which themselves is a plumbing contractor supply company.  We didn't get the stuff from ACE itself because it was made in china :thumbdown: but apprently it is getting harder to find good old USA made pipe :dunno:
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Re: FAQ - Tube vs. Pipe
« Reply #14 on: Jul 17, 2007, 05:32:38 PM »
This is what I am finding...I have read about the as500 (?) grade pipe being about the same material as tubing just made to pipe sizing, but I can't find anything but the cheap black schedule 40...I picked some of that up to give it a shot, but I even went over to the Yard and they had nothing to show in the right sizes. 
IFS is best kept at ambient temperature in a pile of scrap in the backyard.  When kept under a functioning vehicle, it tends to greatly diminish said vehicle's offroad ability.     -reklund5

4Runner: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=4580.0
Beastmaster: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=34339.0

 
 
 
 
 

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