Topic: Scope of Second Amendment questioned

[Ferg]

[quote if guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns...[/quote]

I'll be an 'Outlaw'!

[BikerTrash]

great anyone been watching the news   

Some depressed kid in PA took his daddy's AK and shot up the school  then him self.   

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/local/states/pennsylvania/counties/philadelphia_county/philadelphia/16225883.htm?source=rss&channel=inquirer_philadelphia

You know there gonna blame it on the gun and call for a AK ban.  when it's the kids fault     he could of done it with any gun.

I agree with you 101%, I also think that once they are able to ban these "dangerous" guns they will eventually try to ban all guns once they see that a determined individual can infact do it with anygun.  I was told at work today (bear in mind work is one hundred sumodd miles out in the middle of the gulf of Mexico) that my knife is to large. I need to get a new knife for work because my knife is not a knife, it is a WEAPON.

[quote if guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns...

I'll be an 'Outlaw'!

Amen, Preach it reverend.

[DTB]

I also think that once they are able to ban these "dangerous" guns they will eventually try to ban all guns once they see that a determined individual can infact do it with anygun. 

Just an interesting tidbit....... of all gun deaths in the US, the most are caused with a 22 caliber bullet. Also the most stolen gun too (makes sense)....discuss

[red]

Just an interesting tidbit....... of all gun deaths in the US, the most are caused with a 22 caliber bullet. Also the most stolen gun too (makes sense)....discuss

what are the main killers in the US? i know cigarettes are up there, heart attack and other cholesteral related problems. are we gonna make cigarettes and cholesteral illegal?

[DTB]

are we gonna make cigarettes and cholesteral illegal?

probably look at the controversial trans fat regulations they are trying to pass and cigarettes, yea they've been trying to ban those for years

[kneedownnate]

As much as I hate cigarettes, I think it would be horribly wrong to outlaw them!  The government needs to learn where to draw the line, and shifty lawyers need to learn the ways of lemmings...

[unclejpl4x4]

    IF U wan smoke thats fine with me BUT
1. keep it out of lungs/food
2. stop throing your god dam butts all over the fing place.
3. U would not like if if i was smoking crack/or MJ and forced u 2 inhale the smoke.

[abnormaltoy]

As much as I hate cigarettes, I think it would be horribly wrong to outlaw them!  The government needs to learn where to draw the line, and shifty lawyers need to learn the ways of lemmings...

Nate, your idea is sound but your basis is fundamentally wrong. The government doesn't need to learn where to draw the line...the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence already outlines what the government can and cannot do. We have, for decades been subject to an unelected entity creating legislation. I am, of course speaking of "activist judges". We the people must insist that our elected officials return to the constitutionally mandated form of governing.
One the most people seem to forget...We the people are not subject of the federal government, they work for us.

[red]

x2

and back on topic, IF our society was dumb enough (and with so many idiots in the government it wouldnt surprise me much) that this gun ban passed, how would they enforce it? they cant go into your home without a warrent and they need a reason for that, cant search you without a reason, and cant legally threaten you. so how could they enforce it?

[BLACKDOG [OP]]

x2

and back on topic, IF our society was dumb enough (and with so many idiots in the government it wouldnt surprise me much) that this gun ban passed, how would they enforce it? they cant go into your home without a warrent and they need a reason for that, cant search you without a reason, and cant legally threaten you. so how could they enforce it?
[/quote

Easy, when you shoot the guy who enters your home intending to do you bodily harm, you get arrested for gun possession, not to mention murder because you killed him with an illegal weapon.  Looks like its back to beating the bloody piss out of people with clubs again! 

[6.72:1]

One of my friends is a firm believer in gun ownership.

It would be darn-right scary to see someone try to take them from him.

He always says they can try though...Haha.

He also says, "Only by my dead, cold, life-less fingers will they take my guns...."

[Gewehr43]

I have 13 guns and a couple of them are technically illegal.  What disturbs me is the blatantly stupid punishments for gun "crimes."

You can murder or rape someone and get out in 5 years, and you can be caught with what the BATF randomly decides to call an illegal firearm and get a minimum of 10 years for exercising your consitutional rights.

IMO we are headed for some kind of uprising in the next decade.  No one will take my guns away of keep me from buying more. 

Anyone with any good education would be able to read the Consitution and be able to see that the 2nd Amendment refers to individuals.   When you read the writings of the founding fathers it is clear that their intent is for the milita to be individual citizens that are not paid to serve.

The National Guard is not the militia.  They are essentially an extension of Regular army.  We are the milita.

Just my 

[red]

absolutely right, have you ever looked at the countries that have gun bans? germany when the nazi's were in control? stalin when he controlled russia? anybody realize what a corrupt government can do when its citizens are unable to defend themselves?

[Trunkz]

the national gaurd wascreated in 1903 in the "richard act" named for the writer of the bill... so the constitution in no way refers to the national gaurd that was enacted in 1903

i was taught that there are 3 boxes the people need to know about, the soup box, the ballot box, and the ammo box.. thats they way the founding fathers saw it,

Thomas Jefferson said that thier should be an armed revolution every 20 years to keep the government in check

[Gewehr43]

Hey if you guys are interested in other issues as well I would highly reccomend picking up a copy of the book "The Thirty Years War"  by Balint Vazsonyi(Not sure if I spelled it correctly).  Awesome book.   

Never forget Ruby Ridge and Waco.  The Government will never stop and think before they solve a problem(even a minor one) with extreme violence. 
We all should be wary of the Governments intentions, as our best interests are almost never important factors in their decisions.

There will be a time when our goverment takes that irreversible step over the line and we must stand up for our rights. 

http://www.amazon.com/Americas-Thirty-Years-Balint-Vazsonyi/dp/0895262487

[6.72:1]

 There will be a time when our goverment takes that irreversible step over the line and we must stand up for our rights. 

I'm ready. I can tell you if I gotta go, I'll go out in a hail of gunfire and incendiary blasts.

Not that I own guns or anything else of that nature....

[BikerTrash]

The problem is this, there are three views on gun control as I see it.

There is a vocal minority that does not want anyone to have any guns. The media is on their side, you never hear about some one defending their family with a gun, only about some kid who decides the world is not fair to him and that he need to bring a gun to school to settel his problems. I don't watch the news much anymore, I lost my stomach for it, but you never EVER hear a positive story about guns.

The third view is the passive people, I would imagine this is the largest group. The were never around guns, they don't care about guns, and they believe that if people have the right to have guns or not has no bearing on them. The media is not worried about them but wishes that they would become anti gun so they keep the negative gun coverage flowing. This keeps the first group of people happy because the media is on their side and that makes them right. the more passive people hear no good new about guns so they are inclined to go with the anti gun people just because that is what has been crammed down their throats for so long as being the best and only truth, that gunlaws save us from criminals having guns. And by god if it is illegal for them to have guns then they wont be bale to get guns.

   I consider myself to be in the third group, We want to keep our guns but the majority of us are not as vocal as our believes as the first group of people, if not for the fact that we have been around guns most of our lives then we might as well be in the second group of passive citizens who could care less if the guns are taken away, partly because be believe it will never actually happen, and possibly partly because we are not sure if they are really that necessary.

    Responsible gun owners get upset about their rights getting trampled but that is not a good news story, so you will not hear about it on dateline, or CNN. It is better to have everyone angry at someone who would want to have a "stockpile" of boarderline legal "weapons" than to have the sheep angry at having the rights of honest hardworking citizens taken away from them. After all Why would anyone really NEED a rifle that can fire 30+ or hell during the Brady Bill just 10 or more rounds. High capacity rifles sound like smoothing only criminals would need, for get the fact that going to gunranges is a fun pastime and hurts nobody.

   With the new democrat controlled Congress I will be shocked if we don't see new gun control measures passed. Believe me I will be much happier if they do not come to pass. I don't find it hard to imagine that after out "dangerous" guns are taken away then they will move on, handguns will most likely be next, then who know, nothing but single shot rifles or shotguns then nothing.

 Heres hoping I am wrong.               
                                                    Josh.

[red]

The problem is this, there are three views on gun control as I see it.

There is a vocal minority that does not want anyone to have any guns. The media is on their side, you never hear about some one defending their family with a gun, only about some kid who decides the world is not fair to him and that he need to bring a gun to school to settel his problems. I don't watch the news much anymore, I lost my stomach for it, but you never EVER hear a positive story about guns.

The third view is the passive people, I would imagine this is the largest group. The were never around guns, they don't care about guns, and they believe that if people have the right to have guns or not has no bearing on them. The media is not worried about them but wishes that they would become anti gun so they keep the negative gun coverage flowing. This keeps the first group of people happy because the media is on their side and that makes them right. the more passive people hear no good new about guns so they are inclined to go with the anti gun people just because that is what has been crammed down their throats for so long as being the best and only truth, that gunlaws save us from criminals having guns. And by god if it is illegal for them to have guns then they wont be bale to get guns.

   I consider myself to be in the third group, We want to keep our guns but the majority of us are not as vocal as our believes as the first group of people, if not for the fact that we have been around guns most of our lives then we might as well be in the second group of passive citizens who could care less if the guns are taken away, partly because be believe it will never actually happen, and possibly partly because we are not sure if they are really that necessary.

    Responsible gun owners get upset about their rights getting trampled but that is not a good news story, so you will not hear about it on dateline, or CNN. It is better to have everyone angry at someone who would want to have a "stockpile" of boarderline legal "weapons" than to have the sheep angry at having the rights of honest hardworking citizens taken away from them. After all Why would anyone really NEED a rifle that can fire 30+ or hell during the Brady Bill just 10 or more rounds. High capacity rifles sound like smoothing only criminals would need, for get the fact that going to gunranges is a fun pastime and hurts nobody.

   With the new democrat controlled Congress I will be shocked if we don't see new gun control measures passed. Believe me I will be much happier if they do not come to pass. I don't find it hard to imagine that after out "dangerous" guns are taken away then they will move on, handguns will most likely be next, then who know, nothing but single shot rifles or shotguns then nothing.

 Heres hoping I am wrong.               
                                                    Josh.

i'm hoping your wrong to about what the government will do, unfortunatly our government is run by idiots that are in group 1.

[6.72:1]

The third view is the passive people, I would imagine this is the largest group. The were never around guns, they don't care about guns, and they believe that if people have the right to have guns or not has no bearing on them. The media is not worried about them but wishes that they would become anti gun so they keep the negative gun coverage flowing. This keeps the first group of people happy because the media is on their side and that makes them right. the more passive people hear no good new about guns so they are inclined to go with the anti gun people just because that is what has been crammed down their throats for so long as being the best and only truth, that gunlaws save us from criminals having guns.

...and who is it that we know that runs the media...?