Author Topic: 4 linking rear  (Read 8476 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Keithporter83

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 22
  • Member since Jun '15
  • Crawling with Marlin
4 linking rear
« on: Oct 10, 2016, 05:24:18 PM »
Looking at getting ideas about 4 linking the rear of my 83 I want to do it cheap and run coils on the rear I would also like to cut the frame and have just tube does anyone have pictures and ideas I can look at.

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #1 on: Oct 10, 2016, 07:45:22 PM »
You want a cheap 4link? or you want to save some coin by using coils and standard shocks as opposed to coilovers?
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #2 on: Oct 10, 2016, 10:06:13 PM »
"Cheap" probably shouldn't be part of your search for components that are so crucial to your build.

Buying a kit is probably the best option, and for the links, mounts and hardware, you're probably looking at around $1450 for a decent kit.

Check out Rock Slayer Off-Road in Cali. I saw a pretty sweet kit on instagram, and a lot of people who have his 4-link buggy killer kit are really impressed with it.

Sourcing your own components, you might save a few hundred bucks. The KOH rig that some members of my club built sourced their components from TMR Customs.

So gather a list of what you think you'll need, post it here, and see if you missed anything.
1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

Keithporter83 [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 22
  • Member since Jun '15
  • Crawling with Marlin
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #3 on: Oct 11, 2016, 04:39:10 AM »
I'm going to need links and rod ends also inserts with matching hardware. Was planing on getting the trail gear link mount and Fabing my own for the axle. Shocks and I have a set of front coils out of an xj but I want a really soft setup so I may have to play with different springs and I have the tube to tube the back and cut the frame out just need ideas if different ways to do it.

SqWADoosh

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 10683
  • Male Posts: 2,440
  • Member since Oct '14
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #4 on: Oct 11, 2016, 05:09:13 AM »
Ruffstuff has a very affordable kit and are known for their incredible quality.

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/4LK-MINITOY.html

Keithporter83 [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 22
  • Member since Jun '15
  • Crawling with Marlin
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #5 on: Oct 11, 2016, 08:02:27 AM »
Ruffstuff has a very affordable kit and are known for their incredible quality.

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/4LK-MINITOY.html

I like there kit the most but still not cheap

If I use square tubing I can get my links with ends and hardware for 350 bucks then I can make my own brackets for frame and axle

Mudder

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 3448
  • Posts: 585
  • Member since May '15

Flatjeep

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 10
  • Posts: 26
  • Member since Dec '04
  • Crawling with Marlin
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #7 on: Oct 11, 2016, 08:39:23 AM »
"Cheap" probably shouldn't be part of your search for components that are so crucial to your build.

Buying a kit is probably the best option, and for the links, mounts and hardware, you're probably looking at around $1450 for a decent kit.

Check out Rock Slayer Off-Road in Cali. I saw a pretty sweet kit on instagram, and a lot of people who have his 4-link buggy killer kit are really impressed with it.

Sourcing your own components, you might save a few hundred bucks. The KOH rig that some members of my club built sourced their components from TMR Customs.

So gather a list of what you think you'll need, post it here, and see if you missed anything.

I wouldn't touch the C O C K Slayer stuff if you paid me. They don't know crap about what they are doing. Just search them on pirate and you will find many threads to prove that.
« Last Edit: Oct 11, 2016, 09:09:23 AM by Flatjeep »

SqWADoosh

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 10683
  • Male Posts: 2,440
  • Member since Oct '14
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #8 on: Oct 11, 2016, 09:18:24 AM »
I like there kit the most but still not cheap

If I use square tubing I can get my links with ends and hardware for 350 bucks then I can make my own brackets for frame and axle

That is very cheap for the quality of their brackets and ends. Its always going to be cheaper if you are making your own brackets though.

H8PVMNT

  • Offline Silver Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 451
  • Male Posts: 3,499
  • Member since May '07
  • I'LL NEVER MAKE IT...
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #9 on: Oct 11, 2016, 09:31:24 AM »
Every time I have scored or put on 4x4 trials of rock crawl events the linked rigs get all bound up and/or flopped over in places the leaf spring trucks just wheel right through.  The linked, coiled rigs sure do flex, ride nice and are pimp, but I have not seen enough evidence of real world success to want to do it.

I may have seen a poor sampling and it might be a regional thing, but that's what I have seen.

Keep in mind that I am old and lame though ;).
« Last Edit: Oct 11, 2016, 10:46:27 AM by H8PVMNT »
I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on earth.
Steve McQueen

"Except for maybe Seattle."  -H8PVMNT

"I plan to hit 300k in this truck"  :)bestgen4runner

 "I'm jealous of your shop. It has concrete and doesn't smell like pickles like the old shop  "  300K

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #10 on: Oct 11, 2016, 11:22:06 AM »
Every time I have scored or put on 4x4 trials of rock crawl events the linked rigs get all bound up and/or flopped over in places the leaf spring trucks just wheel right through.  The linked, coiled rigs sure do flex, ride nice and are pimp, but I have not seen enough evidence of real world success to want to do it.

I may have seen a poor sampling and it might be a regional thing, but that's what I have seen.

Keep in mind that I am old and lame though ;).

Bad driving is certainly a part of that, but your argument doesn't go without merit, and its why I urge people to stay away from things like 18" shocks or longer. To much wheel travel looks really good on the ramp and the poser flex shot that lots of companies like to use for advertising but its real world performance is lacking in stability and control-ability.
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

blackdiamond

  • Offline Gold Turtle Award
  • *
  • Turtle Points: 1187
  • Male Posts: 4,880
  • Member since Dec '03
  • Crawlin with Marlin
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #11 on: Oct 11, 2016, 11:42:34 AM »
Bad driving is certainly a part of that, but your argument doesn't go without merit, and its why I urge people to stay away from things like 18" shocks or longer. To much wheel travel looks really good on the ramp and the poser flex shot that lots of companies like to use for advertising but its real world performance is lacking in stability and control-ability.

If I could put my hands on it, there's a particular video on  youtube that shows quite a few nice rigs with one in particular that simply looks top heavy and unstable when going the same places as everyone else.  It's a shop sponsors Jeep so should have a lot of sweet parts, but it's clear, to me at least, that the setup is a failure overall.  You can watch the front end unload on climbs where nobody else seems to have similar issue.  In the end it takes a nasty roll.  I may have to look for the video and post it...
1989 4Runner: Dual Ultimate (Inchworm front & Marlin 4.70 rear), Marlin Twin Stick, 1200-lb clutch, 4.88 R&P, Aussie Front, Detroit rear, 30-spline Longs, Long hub gears, ARP hub and knuckle studs & 35x12.50 Cooper STT PRO tires.  Marlin rear bumper & sliders.  FROR front bumper.  SAS with Alcan springs & Rancho 9000XL shocks.  Budbuilt Bolt-on traction bar.  Custom Interior Cage by Those Guys Rod and Customs.

Moab Tested & Rubicon Approved

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #12 on: Oct 11, 2016, 12:08:23 PM »
Find it and post it. I'll pic it apart.

If you havent figured it out yet let me point you in the right direction. Ready??

There is a difference between a fab shop that can do suspension and a suspension guy. Just because you can cut, bend and weld metal and have worked on a 4x4 before doesnt mean you are qualified to build a suspension system from scratch. Even if you've done it before.   Case in point, i've seen welders that cant fab, and fab guys that cant weld. I've seen pipe welders that think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread say they can weld anything but cant weld 22ga SS together with blowing holes in it.

So i'll go back to the old saying from 10 years ago. "I'll take a good leaf spring design over a crappy link desgin."   "But I'll take a good link design over a great leaf spring"
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

Mudder

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 3448
  • Posts: 585
  • Member since May '15
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #13 on: Oct 11, 2016, 12:29:33 PM »
You really shouldn't build a link suspension unless you're willing to sit down and put a lot of money, time and research into it. TacoRunner has one of the best link suspension you can get for a Toyota, it's not cheap but he's put the time energy and his own money into developing something for us. But not everyone can afford it, google search FourWheeler link suspension and it'll help explain everything that's needed. Unless of course you already know how to do links.

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #14 on: Oct 11, 2016, 12:35:30 PM »
How do you feel about this video?
https://youtu.be/BTWZgVx8Y6o

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #15 on: Oct 11, 2016, 12:36:04 PM »
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #16 on: Oct 11, 2016, 12:44:19 PM »
How do you feel about this video?
https://youtu.be/BTWZgVx8Y6o

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk


His explanation of link angles regarding the broom stick is spot on.   But his recommendations on the link angles them selves is way off.  10* lowers and flat uppers. The upper links job is to tune your anti squat (rear) and anti dive (front)  telling some one is should be flat to the ground is a stupid way to put it and very misleading.
« Last Edit: Oct 11, 2016, 01:26:06 PM by TacoRunner »
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

Keithporter83 [OP]

  • Offline Rock Crawl'n
  • **
  • Turtle Points: 0
  • Posts: 22
  • Member since Jun '15
  • Crawling with Marlin
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #17 on: Oct 11, 2016, 02:58:13 PM »
The reason I want to go cheap is not because I don't want to spend money on it but I like the cheap factor. Just seeing the jeep guys faces when I walk them is awesome  :driving: but my frame from the cab back is done cant even save it with patch work and want to tub it but never really was a tub back half with leafs

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #18 on: Oct 11, 2016, 04:58:15 PM »
Hey I like building my own stuff too. Im not even trying to sell you on my :pokinit:. But my concern is always with guys that say I want to have a kick ass link system for $500. It aint happening. And for the love of God please please do some homework and ask questions. Lots of questions. Talk with a tuner from this industry, email a dude thats built more than one rig, etc. I know there are lots of opinions out there but not all of them are right and others dont matter.
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #19 on: Oct 12, 2016, 01:37:09 AM »
Hey I like building my own stuff too. Im not even trying to sell you on my :pokinit:. But my concern is always with guys that say I want to have a kick ass link system for $500. It aint happening. And for the love of God please please do some homework and ask questions. Lots of questions. Talk with a tuner from this industry, email a dude thats built more than one rig, etc. I know there are lots of opinions out there but not all of them are right and others dont matter.

Just realize I'm already following you on Instagram. Also that you're right next door to me in WA! Also just realized that the 4runner I keep drooling over has your kit. Gonna have to swing by sometime.. You hiring?  :D

To the OP, I'll say that you should look into keeping leafs in the rear and 3 linking the front.

Here's something to help you see what I'm talking about :P


Here's the build:
http://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/88-4-runner-build.214333/


http://www.4wheelunderground.com/testimonials.html
« Last Edit: Oct 12, 2016, 02:16:02 AM by excabswap »
1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #20 on: Oct 12, 2016, 08:17:32 AM »
If you want to stop by and take a look at some of what i do, feel free. Grab my number off the website. I'd highly recommend stopping by this week if possible as I've got several bracket kits on the floor getting ready to ship.
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

Ritchie

  • Offline Rock Master
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 453
  • Male Posts: 206
  • Member since May '13
  • Ritchie
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #21 on: Oct 12, 2016, 03:35:57 PM »
Excabswap,
Take Brian up on his offer to stop by.

While he was located in Simi Valley, I spent some time there.  I do suggest taping a pad to your chin as it will hurt less when it hits the floor.

All parts/ bins are organized, machinery is clean and definitely functional.  Workmanship is superior to anything you'll most likely see in a great while.

Add to that, he's a cool guy to kick it with.
'02 Prerunner, ARB F/R w/5.29's, 4WU 3 link, Diamonds F/R, Fox shocks F/R, Shrockworks front bumper, self made rear bumper, WARN M8000S, Inchworm Lefty, Deaver 8 pack, self made sliders that hold air & a bunch of other stuff.

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #22 on: Oct 14, 2016, 01:30:40 AM »
Hey Brian, Just curious, if someone wanted to, could they weld on the brackets of your 3Link Bracket Kit and keep the factory suspension on the rear until they're ready to link?
1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #23 on: Oct 14, 2016, 02:38:51 PM »
Clarify for me please. convert front to a 3link and maintain leaves in the rear?
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #24 on: Oct 14, 2016, 02:59:27 PM »
I mean, i have leafs in the rear, and without reviving anything can I weld on the brackets only so that once everything is ready I could just remove the leafs and bolt on the links?

Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

SqWADoosh

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 10683
  • Male Posts: 2,440
  • Member since Oct '14
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #25 on: Oct 14, 2016, 06:54:18 PM »
4 link is for rear. 3 link is for front.

ExCabSwap

  • Offline Crawler Guru
  • ****
  • Turtle Points: 1012
  • Male Posts: 675
  • Member since Jan '16
  • 3rd Gen ExCab Swap!
    • Buy me a soda
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #26 on: Oct 14, 2016, 11:31:57 PM »
Yup.

I'm curious if the rear link brackets can be welded to the frame without removing any of the leaf hangers
1993 Standard cab chassis. 1989 Extended Cab. 22R-E BO .020, ENGNBLDR 261c cam, Doug Thorley Tri-Y header, Straight Pipe through a Flowmaster 40, ARB Rear Locker, York OBA with fabricated bracket.
Projects waiting in my shop: '83 Front Axle, TG Sliders, second tcase, NEW: XD 4.70 gears!

TacoRunner

  • Offline The 2K Group
  • ***
  • Turtle Points: 19177
  • Male Posts: 2,324
  • Member since Feb '04
  • The 1st 3RZ swap 99'-01'
    • 4wheelunderground
Re: 4 linking rear
« Reply #27 on: Oct 15, 2016, 11:49:04 AM »
Since you've got two upper links that go from center of axle to the frame your gas tank will be in the way and will have to be removed. So... no you cant. And honestly its not worth trying to install parts for a future upgrade any ways. The frame brackets we build slide along the inside of the frame and incorporate the upper link mounts as well, making the install very straight forward and quick.
www.4WHEELUNDERGROUND.com
info@4wheelunderground.com
AKA The GODFATHER The 3RZ Original

Performance Tuned shocks for Leaf Sprung Vehicles   http://www.4wheelunderground.com/Tuning.html

 
 
 
 
 

Related Topics

0 Replies
382 Views
Last post Jan 18, 2014, 02:46:53 PM
by RedlineRossco
2 Replies
725 Views
Last post Jan 18, 2014, 10:02:09 PM
by Wainiha
25 Replies
2108 Views
Last post Mar 02, 2014, 02:17:49 AM
by toe
16 Replies
2748 Views
Last post Sep 11, 2014, 07:05:25 AM
by Nation
1 Replies
579 Views
Last post May 02, 2015, 03:42:17 PM
by 8T3