Topic: 22re HG and timing chain replaced.... but still need help, no start

[bleakhorizon]

Lots of info on the internet about this but seems I (as always) have something a little bit different

first off 93 22re...

Ive done more than my fair share of t-chains on 20 and 22r engines but im not so great with the fuel injected engines i guess.  I got the head surfaced, new gaskets, new chain, tensioner, guides etc etc.  I get the truck back together and the truck doesnt start, cranks REALLY slow (and seems like starter is straining) for like 8 revolutions then kinda speeds up a bit (like when yea flood an engine and then it starts to clear up)....once in a while it has a hickup like compression but to no avail. Check engine light is on!

soo here is what i know..Timing set at 0 on crank, dot on cam gear aligned with bright link, dist rotor pointed at #1 spark plug when installed, with or without dist timing shorted, no start.... Good compression and leakdown test passed but i also noticed today that after i crank it for a while it seems there is exhaust (combustion pressure?) coming from the oil galley (took the Valve cover off and its coming up from the pan). has fuel pressure but if the injectors are firing IDK. cant really tell from the spark plugs...

I know im prob missing something, most likily really easy, but im trying to exhaust my resources before i pull the front cover off (its damn cold outside lol)

 Im thinking timing, mainly because i sprayed ether into the intake and it still didnt even fire, i didnt do anything to the valve lash and its all in spec..But for all i know the injectors arnt firing....  im to my wits end, about to take it to a mechanic (really dont wana do that) just thought i would shoot it out there for yea guys to laugh at me   

[Cheesemaker]

What code is it throwing?
Got fuel pressure?  Crack the cold start injector and it should spray out.
Getting spark?

Is the dot on the cam gear when its at tdc at about the 11:00 position?
You've thoroughly made sure all the wires are connected? 

Give us a thorough list of all the things you've checked Toby.  If your timing is on and you've got spark, ether should have made that motor run for a few seconds.  I know its cold out.  I need to change some belts and its too cold in my shop to do it.

[79coyotefrg]

when the crank is on 0*  the cam (regardless of location of shiney links) should be at 1/2 a link from 12 o clock, like 11:45 ish

the cam dowel should be at 12 o clock,

[bleakhorizon [OP]]

YEP i feel like a newb, bet that dot is at 12 when i look at it tonite....ug lol

[H8PVMNT]

Did you hook up the ground from the back of the head to the firewall?  That ground being damaged or unhooked will cause them not to start...

[bleakhorizon [OP]]

Did you hook up the ground from the back of the head to the firewall?  That ground being damaged or unhooked will cause them not to start...

yes i did. Im still a bit confused on the slow crank but if the timing is off by a tooth im thinking that could do it...

yes i got spark and fuel pressure, at least enough to spray all over the place when yea dont tighten the fuel filter all the way(its been relocated to inner the fender)

Talked to the owner im getting the rest of the story however.... seems he bought the truck with the blown headgasket, so it has not run since he has owned it... great, lol what did i get myself into now...

Now if it would just get above 30 degrees lol, i was used to this cold when i lived in Wyoming, not anymore.

[H8PVMNT]

Yeah you must be off a tooth or two somewhere...  Good luck dude!  

Seems like I did that once a long time ago and had the same thing happen.  Start with the distributor and if that's not it I guess you had better peel off the timing cover again.  Let us know what it is when you figure it out.

 

[Cheesemaker]

Sounds like you bought a project rig!!   

[BUDDERS]

Well if you've worked on 20r and 22r engines, your probably not familiar with the ignition timing of a 22re.  The cam/crank timing in relation to the timing chain is just like the 20/22r's but the distributor needs to be installed when the crank is pulley is at 5 degrees (instead of 0 degrees like the 20/22r) and the dist rotor needs to be pointed at the #1 postition.

Hope this helps.

[bleakhorizon [OP]]

ok so i finally got around to freezn my butt off checkn everything again..... got the dist on #1 cylinder & @ TDC on #1, 0* on the crank, cam dot is at 11:30..... still no run........hmmmmmmmm... idk what is going on....

i was thinking about changing the timing a tooth on the cam gear I.E. dot at 11 o clock ( i think thats the right way) of course i would rotate it over to make sure the valves arnt going to touch before i try to crank it, but im really running out of things to check.... i know that at least the cold start injector is getting fuel...

[bleakhorizon [OP]]

well didnt mess with the cam timing today, i decided to check the compression more accurately today (more than my finger over the hole lol) well its got out of all the cylinders the max is 40 psi.... WTF i hate worken on other peoples basketcase rigs.  when i took the head off the cylinders were pretty nasty looking rusty looking (plugs had been out of the engine for months ), i cleaned um up pretty good but it seems the rings may be frozen... anyone got any idea what i can do now...short of a ring job..would dumping something down the cylinders to try and free up the rings do anything ?

[BUDDERS]

ok so i finally got around to freezn my butt off checkn everything again..... got the dist on #1 cylinder & @ TDC on #1, 0* on the crank, cam dot is at 11:30..... still no run........hmmmmmmmm... idk what is going on....

i was thinking about changing the timing a tooth on the cam gear I.E. dot at 11 o clock ( i think thats the right way) of course i would rotate it over to make sure the valves arnt going to touch before i try to crank it, but im really running out of things to check.... i know that at least the cold start injector is getting fuel...

The dist should be on #1 with the crank at 5*, not zero! - (this is only for a 22re)

Squirting a little oil down the plug holes won't do any harm and could only help (although, there will be smoke out the tailpipe when it does fire up.  I'd sqirt some oil into the cylinders and rotate the crank around by hand a few times to make sure nothing is binding and let it sit like that overnight, then check the compression.  If it's still around 40psi, your cam timing must be off and needs to be changed.  If you loosen up your timing chain and bump your cam over 1 more tooth, will your cam be at 12:00?  If so, that's what I'd do.

[79coyotefrg]

Budders, i didnt know that about the RE timing.

NO dont go to 11 oclock,  go to 12 oclock,  i would squirt some ATF down in the cylinders (plugs removed) rotate it once or twice then let it sit over night,  then spin it over and check compression again, if its still at 40psi,  the cam timing being off before probably bent the valves

[79coyotefrg]

here is a pic of EXACTLY where your cam timing should be

note the cam "dimple" timing mark is just about 1/2 a tooth to the left of tdc

[bleakhorizon [OP]]

yep thats were its at....  i had a searchfest and found damn near EVERY picture of the cam gear on the internet and they all look exactly like what i got.

when i first put it together i rotated it by hand without the plugs in, and other than it being harder to turn than it should be (all the time) it never got stuck...
 
today i got it to hickup with starting fluid making it turn over faster like it wanted to start, thats when i did the compression test and found only 30 30 40 30 psi in the cylinders.... im thinking that its turning over slow because of either the scored cylinders or bad bearings now....... Im thinking im gona have to tell the guy that he needs a new engine. . . unless i rebuild it im not sure that it will be capable of running...

[Cheesemaker]

How many miles are on the motor?

[BUDDERS]

Budders, i didnt know that about the RE timing.

Yep, found that out the hard way after I built the motor on my '87 2wd.  I had it setup for timing on a 22r and the damn thing wouldn't start, then one of the other old timer techs at work told me about how you are supposed to setup the dist on a 22re.